Please Help! Cap female/Pisces male (PART ONE)
This topic was created in the Capricorn forum by Tiffani on Saturday, December 22, 2007 and has 9 replies.
Sigh, how to begin...? (This is a looooooooong post)
I ask that all please refrain from judging me, my life choices or circumstances. It is very difficult for me to be completely honest about this situation when "questionable" circumstances exist. Thank you in advance. I do appreciate it...
Ok, I am an attached bi-sexual Capricorn female- (12 years) with Gemini female. I love her very much, however, our relationship has been extremely turbulent at times. Unfortunately, some scars are still there after all of these years, as it happens sometimes. We still have our problems, and I will get to those later...
9 years ago, our relationship was especially turbulent. I sincerely felt that she was cheating on me, at the time. Also at the time, I was working at a pizza shop where I met an incredible person, (Pisces male), whom over the period of a few months, I basically fell in love with. It happened before I realized it.
Oh, it was great! He was a musician, like myself, and we would talk about music for hours. He was also a mathematical and mechanical whiz and his knowledge captivated and deeply interested me. I could listen to him talk about the similarities of water and electricity for hours. He taught me how to drive a manual transmission and was always so caring and attentive to me. We shared our feelings with each other. We had sex one time, but it was a rushed event.
Oh, but the way he would hold me, touch me and look at me made me totally melt inside. I remember one night, we were driving around and listening to the radio. The Rolling Stones' Beast of Burden was on and I remember the way he looked at me while the song played, all of the lyrics were on his face and in his eyes. I truly felt that he was in love with me, though he never said so.
He was married to a scornful wife, at the time, with two small children, and I had my relationship with my partner, of course. Well, one day I told her about him to hurt her because I felt that she deserved it, after how she had been deceiving me for almost a year, at the time. It was a stupid reaction, but I was only about 20 y/o then. It caused a storm and it caused me to break things off with him. I told him that she asked me if I were seeing anyone and that I told her about him. He understood and to my knowledge, did not harbor any ill feelings. Soon after, he was transferred to another store.
(((CONTINUED ON PART TWO.....)))
I ask that all please refrain from judging me, my life choices or circumstances. It is very difficult for me to be completely honest about this situation when "questionable" circumstances exist. Thank you in advance. I do appreciate it...
Ok, I am an attached bi-sexual Capricorn female- (12 years) with Gemini female. I love her very much, however, our relationship has been extremely turbulent at times. Unfortunately, some scars are still there after all of these years, as it happens sometimes. We still have our problems, and I will get to those later...
9 years ago, our relationship was especially turbulent. I sincerely felt that she was cheating on me, at the time. Also at the time, I was working at a pizza shop where I met an incredible person, (Pisces male), whom over the period of a few months, I basically fell in love with. It happened before I realized it.
Oh, it was great! He was a musician, like myself, and we would talk about music for hours. He was also a mathematical and mechanical whiz and his knowledge captivated and deeply interested me. I could listen to him talk about the similarities of water and electricity for hours. He taught me how to drive a manual transmission and was always so caring and attentive to me. We shared our feelings with each other. We had sex one time, but it was a rushed event.
Oh, but the way he would hold me, touch me and look at me made me totally melt inside. I remember one night, we were driving around and listening to the radio. The Rolling Stones' Beast of Burden was on and I remember the way he looked at me while the song played, all of the lyrics were on his face and in his eyes. I truly felt that he was in love with me, though he never said so.
He was married to a scornful wife, at the time, with two small children, and I had my relationship with my partner, of course. Well, one day I told her about him to hurt her because I felt that she deserved it, after how she had been deceiving me for almost a year, at the time. It was a stupid reaction, but I was only about 20 y/o then. It caused a storm and it caused me to break things off with him. I told him that she asked me if I were seeing anyone and that I told her about him. He understood and to my knowledge, did not harbor any ill feelings. Soon after, he was transferred to another store.
(((CONTINUED ON PART TWO.....)))
Continued....)))))))))))
I saw him several months later, one night when he visited the store. He went on a delivery with me and out of the blue, he kissed me. I could still see the desire for me in his dreamy expression. After that night, we lost touch until a few weeks ago.
Fast forward a bit...
I am still with the same woman, who I DO love, but the passion isn't there anymore. Neither of us could survive financially on our own, at the moment. We have a house and pets to take care of. I know that she loves me more than she's loved anyone else, and I feel the same way about her, though scars from the past have taken their toll. For instance, we make love about once every 2-3 months, these days. I am a very sexual and sensual person and I've had to learn how to cope with the rejection from her. She's always tired, or needing to wake early in the morning, etc. I do not feel that she's being unfaithful, and I know her well enough to make a clear judgment call on that.
So, while I'm sex and affection starved, I start dreaming about him. For several nights, I dreamt of the two of us, (Pisces male and me), making love, cuddling and laughing together. After the 6th dream, I decided to track him down. So, I looked up his father in the phone directory, who gave me his current cell phone number.
I called him and foolishly told him about my dreams and desires for him, again. He couldn't speak freely because his now teenage kids were around, though he seemed flattered and easy-going about it. My expressions were intensified due to the fact that it was surreal just talking to him, and due to my suppressed passion and desires in my relationship, as it is. Still, revealing so much, out of the sky into his lap was probably not a good idea. He did tell me that he had thought about me but couldn't remember my last name to track me down.
I found out that he is now divorced, but living with a woman who he doesn't want to be in a relationship with. Apparently, they've known each other since school and started to hang out after he was divorced. He said that at first, both of them had full freedom to see whoever they wanted to see, but their interaction became so frequent that now they are basically married, minus the paper. He is not happy in this arrangement and says the he's tried to break it off before, but that something always happened that kept them together.
Continued...)))
I saw him several months later, one night when he visited the store. He went on a delivery with me and out of the blue, he kissed me. I could still see the desire for me in his dreamy expression. After that night, we lost touch until a few weeks ago.
Fast forward a bit...
I am still with the same woman, who I DO love, but the passion isn't there anymore. Neither of us could survive financially on our own, at the moment. We have a house and pets to take care of. I know that she loves me more than she's loved anyone else, and I feel the same way about her, though scars from the past have taken their toll. For instance, we make love about once every 2-3 months, these days. I am a very sexual and sensual person and I've had to learn how to cope with the rejection from her. She's always tired, or needing to wake early in the morning, etc. I do not feel that she's being unfaithful, and I know her well enough to make a clear judgment call on that.
So, while I'm sex and affection starved, I start dreaming about him. For several nights, I dreamt of the two of us, (Pisces male and me), making love, cuddling and laughing together. After the 6th dream, I decided to track him down. So, I looked up his father in the phone directory, who gave me his current cell phone number.
I called him and foolishly told him about my dreams and desires for him, again. He couldn't speak freely because his now teenage kids were around, though he seemed flattered and easy-going about it. My expressions were intensified due to the fact that it was surreal just talking to him, and due to my suppressed passion and desires in my relationship, as it is. Still, revealing so much, out of the sky into his lap was probably not a good idea. He did tell me that he had thought about me but couldn't remember my last name to track me down.
I found out that he is now divorced, but living with a woman who he doesn't want to be in a relationship with. Apparently, they've known each other since school and started to hang out after he was divorced. He said that at first, both of them had full freedom to see whoever they wanted to see, but their interaction became so frequent that now they are basically married, minus the paper. He is not happy in this arrangement and says the he's tried to break it off before, but that something always happened that kept them together.
Continued...)))
Cont...
When hinting about us picking up where we left off, as far as making unrushed love, he told me that we would need to gain approval from our partners, beforehand. My partner will allow me to occasionally sleep with men, knowing that I'm bisexual and that occasionally, I desire to be with a man. I haven't taken her up on the offer though. He told me that his partner would need to approve of whomever he is to sleep with, and that she claims to be ok with him sleeping with women she approves of.
We made plans for a visit. He told me to call him 3 days from then to get directions to his house. Emotional me, called him the next day, just to hear his voice. After that call, I waited until that Friday (the original 3 day period), to call him for directions to his home for the next day.
Saturday...
I visited him and his girlfriend, who in my opinion seemed a bit insecure. She had this need to showcase her sexuality by slipping in tidbits about her escapades, at any opportunity, almost as if I were supposed to be impressed or shocked. I don't shock easily and little does she know about what lives in my erotic mind. As a Capricorn, I am outwardly reserved, but my desire, passion and sense of kink runs deeper than even "he" is aware of...
I could tell that she was a little jealous by the way she would so subtly but nastily tell him that she wanted something too, in regard to the times he would get a refreshment for me and not ask her if she wanted something, also. I do not know if he normally serves her or what, but she seemed a little miffed. Also, out of the blue, she tells him..." 'Dana (a friend of hers), told me that I've got you wrapped around my finger." I couldn't believe it! He didn't seem to care for the remark either, but he hid it well. Still, I could tell it bothered him, as it would most people.
When him and I would talk, she would look at him, seeming trying to read his face. She was searching his face for something. He was very respectful of her and didn't oogle over me or anything, (though I looked better than he's ever seen me)...
I told them that I should be going and his neck snapped towards me. His eyes said, "Don't go."
At the end of the night, he walked me out to my car, with her in the house still. He stood by my car while I got inside. I needed to feel him, so I told him that he was due a hug. I got out of my car and he wrapped his arms around me and let me tell you...it felt as if I had been away over seas for ye
When hinting about us picking up where we left off, as far as making unrushed love, he told me that we would need to gain approval from our partners, beforehand. My partner will allow me to occasionally sleep with men, knowing that I'm bisexual and that occasionally, I desire to be with a man. I haven't taken her up on the offer though. He told me that his partner would need to approve of whomever he is to sleep with, and that she claims to be ok with him sleeping with women she approves of.
We made plans for a visit. He told me to call him 3 days from then to get directions to his house. Emotional me, called him the next day, just to hear his voice. After that call, I waited until that Friday (the original 3 day period), to call him for directions to his home for the next day.
Saturday...
I visited him and his girlfriend, who in my opinion seemed a bit insecure. She had this need to showcase her sexuality by slipping in tidbits about her escapades, at any opportunity, almost as if I were supposed to be impressed or shocked. I don't shock easily and little does she know about what lives in my erotic mind. As a Capricorn, I am outwardly reserved, but my desire, passion and sense of kink runs deeper than even "he" is aware of...
I could tell that she was a little jealous by the way she would so subtly but nastily tell him that she wanted something too, in regard to the times he would get a refreshment for me and not ask her if she wanted something, also. I do not know if he normally serves her or what, but she seemed a little miffed. Also, out of the blue, she tells him..." 'Dana (a friend of hers), told me that I've got you wrapped around my finger." I couldn't believe it! He didn't seem to care for the remark either, but he hid it well. Still, I could tell it bothered him, as it would most people.
When him and I would talk, she would look at him, seeming trying to read his face. She was searching his face for something. He was very respectful of her and didn't oogle over me or anything, (though I looked better than he's ever seen me)...
I told them that I should be going and his neck snapped towards me. His eyes said, "Don't go."
At the end of the night, he walked me out to my car, with her in the house still. He stood by my car while I got inside. I needed to feel him, so I told him that he was due a hug. I got out of my car and he wrapped his arms around me and let me tell you...it felt as if I had been away over seas for ye
...it felt as if I had been away over seas for years, and had finally come home. He held me tight and rubbed my back with both hands while he sighed and breathed deeply. Our embrace felt totally natural and "right." I pulled away from him, but he had my hand in his. He looked at me and told me to keep in touch. I told him that I would.
Since then, we've talked a few times, most notably was about a week ago. Finally, we were able to have a deep discussion about the pros and cons of moving further. He said that he and his girlfriend's relationship was screwed up and happened the "wrong way."He agreed that our interaction years ago was always more than physical. He even added that it "happened the right way." He agreed that our embrace felt natural and right, and he told me that he had wanted to know how I felt about our hug.
He told me that he was planning on sitting down with his gf after the holidays to tell her that they should break to see other people. He added that if he tells me that they've broken up, it wouldn't be because of me, so I wouldn't feel guilty. I didn't understand where that came from. Though, I believe that he wanted me to be aware of his desire to be relationship free (without saying the actual words).
He also told me to that he isn't interested in a relationship with anyone, that he never had a chance to be single after his divorce. Also, he told me about his neighbor, whom he's flirted with and a very longtime friend whom he's never slept with. He said that he told her that they should sleep together just once, based on how they always flirt around. This came from me telling him that I wanted to make love to him at least one time, the "right" way. Really, it was all vague, but the message I got was that he wanted me to be aware that he wants his freedom to see whom he chooses. Anyway, I asked him if he felt that we should have sex again. His response was "I would enjoy it." Though, that really tells me squat. Of course, he would enjoy it, but does he want to? That's what I wanted to know. Still, I didn't press for an answer.
To be continued...)))))))
Since then, we've talked a few times, most notably was about a week ago. Finally, we were able to have a deep discussion about the pros and cons of moving further. He said that he and his girlfriend's relationship was screwed up and happened the "wrong way."He agreed that our interaction years ago was always more than physical. He even added that it "happened the right way." He agreed that our embrace felt natural and right, and he told me that he had wanted to know how I felt about our hug.
He told me that he was planning on sitting down with his gf after the holidays to tell her that they should break to see other people. He added that if he tells me that they've broken up, it wouldn't be because of me, so I wouldn't feel guilty. I didn't understand where that came from. Though, I believe that he wanted me to be aware of his desire to be relationship free (without saying the actual words).
He also told me to that he isn't interested in a relationship with anyone, that he never had a chance to be single after his divorce. Also, he told me about his neighbor, whom he's flirted with and a very longtime friend whom he's never slept with. He said that he told her that they should sleep together just once, based on how they always flirt around. This came from me telling him that I wanted to make love to him at least one time, the "right" way. Really, it was all vague, but the message I got was that he wanted me to be aware that he wants his freedom to see whom he chooses. Anyway, I asked him if he felt that we should have sex again. His response was "I would enjoy it." Though, that really tells me squat. Of course, he would enjoy it, but does he want to? That's what I wanted to know. Still, I didn't press for an answer.
To be continued...)))))))
I told him that though I felt that he is a soul mate, I didn't want to be in a relationship with him, either and that I respect his wishes, etc. In truth, it would be extremely complicated for me to break up with my girl and move along with him, but I realize that he and I would make a great couple. I didn't tell him this, though. I did tell him that I felt us messing around could be dangerous in the sense that one or both of us might want to be together more than once. He seemed to want to "commit" to having sex- once only, though he never actually said that he would with me, at all.
He expressed that he wouldn't want me to feel guilty and I assured him that I would not, which is the truth. He also expressed that he didn't want anyone to get hurt. So, I asked him if he felt that I would be hurt if we progressed. He responded, saying that he felt I was old enough to know what I was doing. I assured him that my partner wouldn't be hurt because I would tell her that I would be "seeing" someone else. There are two guys I could mention that would hurt her if she knew I was wanting to see them- Pisces is one of those men.
He said that it doesn't bother him that I've popped back up, again. He added that there are women whom he wouldn't want to talk to again, if they were to call and go "off of the deep end," but that I wasn't one of them. I didn't necessarily take that as a compliment or an insult, just kind of ...well ok....?
I told him that I felt that his girlfriend wasn't fond of me. He said that she did, to which I responded that she had "reservations" about me. I could feel it and see it as thick as you may. At the time of this call, his son and his son's female friend were at his house. Apparently she wanted Pisces' attention, and from out of nowhere he says, " 'Girlfriend' isn't jealous of you, but 'son's friend' is." Of course, this was in a joking manner. I had no idea where that came from, given the fact that I had not told him that I felt that she was jealous (even though I felt that vibe). Instead, I told him that I felt that she had reservations about me. The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive. I wonder if he was trying to project the opposite truth by volunteering this information.
To be cont...)))
He expressed that he wouldn't want me to feel guilty and I assured him that I would not, which is the truth. He also expressed that he didn't want anyone to get hurt. So, I asked him if he felt that I would be hurt if we progressed. He responded, saying that he felt I was old enough to know what I was doing. I assured him that my partner wouldn't be hurt because I would tell her that I would be "seeing" someone else. There are two guys I could mention that would hurt her if she knew I was wanting to see them- Pisces is one of those men.
He said that it doesn't bother him that I've popped back up, again. He added that there are women whom he wouldn't want to talk to again, if they were to call and go "off of the deep end," but that I wasn't one of them. I didn't necessarily take that as a compliment or an insult, just kind of ...well ok....?
I told him that I felt that his girlfriend wasn't fond of me. He said that she did, to which I responded that she had "reservations" about me. I could feel it and see it as thick as you may. At the time of this call, his son and his son's female friend were at his house. Apparently she wanted Pisces' attention, and from out of nowhere he says, " 'Girlfriend' isn't jealous of you, but 'son's friend' is." Of course, this was in a joking manner. I had no idea where that came from, given the fact that I had not told him that I felt that she was jealous (even though I felt that vibe). Instead, I told him that I felt that she had reservations about me. The two are not necessarily mutually exclusive. I wonder if he was trying to project the opposite truth by volunteering this information.
To be cont...)))
My friend told me not to call him again, that I should wait for him to call me, but I really wish to talk to him. The last time I called him was 3 days ago. I haven't really given him a chance to call me because I always call him first. So, this time, my plan is to wait it out, but this feels torturous.
I read that Pisces men will feel rejected if you don't chase them, however, someone else told me to make him come to me, by not calling him, at all. I'm more confused, now...
Basically, it feels that he's hiding his feelings from me. I KNOW he is. What, though?
Is he afraid of falling for me again?
Is he afraid of being hurt (was he referencing himself)?
Is he afraid of me becoming too attached to him?
Should I wait for him to call me, as my friend suggests?
Did my passion get me in trouble, by expressing too much?
Does he want to only have sex once because he wants to "do me a favor," or because he doesn't want either of us to become attached?
(I only told him "once" as an expression. Of course, I'd want to make love to him whenever we both feel the need for each other).
All I know is, whenever I call him, his voice lights up. The way he held me, and then my hand a couple of weeks ago was unmistakable. I truly felt his emotion for me. Could that have been an illusion, though he agreed that it was natural and right?
Of course, I have my relationship and I desperately don't want to hurt her. i realize that my desires are selfish, but in an asshole way, I feel almost justified, due to her being well aware of my needs that aren't being met. This isn't a new thing. The non-sex in my relationship has been going on for several years, 5 or more to be exact. We're talking sex 6-10 times a year, with 10 being the high scale. I realize how careful with my heart I would need to be with this man, whom I feel is my other soul mate.
The more I think about it, the more angry I become. First, I'm angry at myself for opening myself up (foolishly) as I did, because all I've received from him is vague. I even told him that I felt foolish, and his response was, "uh huh." He was paying attention to me, but no assurance or anything. I'm angry because I'm starting to think that he was telling me about his neighbor and long-time friend to test me for jealousy. Either that, or he wants me to know that he's not interested in me, instead of being upfront with it. Maybe it's his way of not hurting my feelings.
To be cont...)))
I read that Pisces men will feel rejected if you don't chase them, however, someone else told me to make him come to me, by not calling him, at all. I'm more confused, now...
Basically, it feels that he's hiding his feelings from me. I KNOW he is. What, though?
Is he afraid of falling for me again?
Is he afraid of being hurt (was he referencing himself)?
Is he afraid of me becoming too attached to him?
Should I wait for him to call me, as my friend suggests?
Did my passion get me in trouble, by expressing too much?
Does he want to only have sex once because he wants to "do me a favor," or because he doesn't want either of us to become attached?
(I only told him "once" as an expression. Of course, I'd want to make love to him whenever we both feel the need for each other).
All I know is, whenever I call him, his voice lights up. The way he held me, and then my hand a couple of weeks ago was unmistakable. I truly felt his emotion for me. Could that have been an illusion, though he agreed that it was natural and right?
Of course, I have my relationship and I desperately don't want to hurt her. i realize that my desires are selfish, but in an asshole way, I feel almost justified, due to her being well aware of my needs that aren't being met. This isn't a new thing. The non-sex in my relationship has been going on for several years, 5 or more to be exact. We're talking sex 6-10 times a year, with 10 being the high scale. I realize how careful with my heart I would need to be with this man, whom I feel is my other soul mate.
The more I think about it, the more angry I become. First, I'm angry at myself for opening myself up (foolishly) as I did, because all I've received from him is vague. I even told him that I felt foolish, and his response was, "uh huh." He was paying attention to me, but no assurance or anything. I'm angry because I'm starting to think that he was telling me about his neighbor and long-time friend to test me for jealousy. Either that, or he wants me to know that he's not interested in me, instead of being upfront with it. Maybe it's his way of not hurting my feelings.
To be cont...)))
I find myself wanting to call him to let him know that he hurt me some when he's made no truly outwardly positive statements about me, but instead, offered a "Well, I guess" attitude, all the while telling me about the other women he thinks about. I want to ask him if I've hurt or angered him in some way, and if him telling me about the other women was a way to express it. I want to tell him that if he's genuinely not interested, I would rather him use a different approach instead of making me feel inadequate by not including me in his "harem thought." I want to tell him that I made a mistake by contacting him after all of this time, and that I will retreat, but without ill feelings. I I've been rejected enough in my relationship. I can't take being rejected by being made to feel inadequate, by him- a man I very highly regard.
Anyway, thanks to anyone who cares enough to respond. I appreciate all advise. I'm so fucking lost and torn right now. On one side, I want to get to the bottom of things, on the other side, I don't want to scare him away by trying to get to the bottom of things. It is taking everything NOT to call him.
Sigh....
Thanks for reading my novel,
Tiffani
Anyway, thanks to anyone who cares enough to respond. I appreciate all advise. I'm so fucking lost and torn right now. On one side, I want to get to the bottom of things, on the other side, I don't want to scare him away by trying to get to the bottom of things. It is taking everything NOT to call him.
Sigh....
Thanks for reading my novel,
Tiffani
?
Thanks for the replies and obviously, for taking the time to respond.
To sagigoat: Your response, was especially insightful and very appreciated. Thank you.
"Also, sex (what i mean is physical intimacy. not intercourse per say) between lovers is not and should not be pure physical acts. They are one of the most important channels/ways of communicating love, passion and erotic desire only two of you share, if not the most important."
I most definitely agree. In fact, I cannot be moved to become sexual with anyone whom there is no emotional connection.
To Atlantic Mist, er I guess to both of you: My relationship is very hard to leave because as much as I wish we were more intimate, there are other aspects, (not financial), in which she does provide. She is the best listener and nurturer, and she truly does love me- unconditionally. The only thing missing, really, is the sex.
I could put more effort into doing the things that would put her in the mood, more frequently. Also, we've dealt with a lot of negative financial surprises, which causes drain and stress. Being stressed out can definitely zap all of your energy. Also, within the past few years, both of us have lost loved ones and experienced deep depression because of it. Whenever we do makelove, it is amazing.
My interest shifts from wanting to work things out with her and put in more effort for intimacy, to accepting things the way they are but being open to sharing intimacy with others who come into my life. I feel that I am at a cross roads and I need to choose one or the other.
Again, thanks for the advice, you two...
Tiffani
To sagigoat: Your response, was especially insightful and very appreciated. Thank you.
"Also, sex (what i mean is physical intimacy. not intercourse per say) between lovers is not and should not be pure physical acts. They are one of the most important channels/ways of communicating love, passion and erotic desire only two of you share, if not the most important."
I most definitely agree. In fact, I cannot be moved to become sexual with anyone whom there is no emotional connection.
To Atlantic Mist, er I guess to both of you: My relationship is very hard to leave because as much as I wish we were more intimate, there are other aspects, (not financial), in which she does provide. She is the best listener and nurturer, and she truly does love me- unconditionally. The only thing missing, really, is the sex.
I could put more effort into doing the things that would put her in the mood, more frequently. Also, we've dealt with a lot of negative financial surprises, which causes drain and stress. Being stressed out can definitely zap all of your energy. Also, within the past few years, both of us have lost loved ones and experienced deep depression because of it. Whenever we do makelove, it is amazing.
My interest shifts from wanting to work things out with her and put in more effort for intimacy, to accepting things the way they are but being open to sharing intimacy with others who come into my life. I feel that I am at a cross roads and I need to choose one or the other.
Again, thanks for the advice, you two...
Tiffani
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