
Quest4Water
@Quest4Water
12 Years
Comments: 0 · Posts: 407 · Topics: 16

Posted by Prince_Pisces
Yeah, apparently this is a big deal LOL! Last time I checked, they were just a bunch of dirty rednecks that lived out in the swamp. Not sure why anyones listening to them in the first place.
Posted by gemini64Posted by Prince_Pisces
Yeah, apparently this is a big deal LOL! Last time I checked, they were just a bunch of dirty rednecks that lived out in the swamp. Not sure why anyones listening to them in the first place.click to expand
Because first of all, there is a thing in the US Constitution called the 1st amendment. If you are a US citizen, you have every right to express your opinion, whether you are a Christian, an Atheist, Straight or Gay, Male or Female.
Secondly, this country was founded upon Christian and Judeo principles. If you don't like it, you can always move to a more tolerant society as Iran, Saudi, Afghanistan or even Russia where gays are killed simply for being gay.
Thirdly, The Robertsons are not only good people, they built an empire on hard work, innovation and principle. I realize you don't share in their core values. That's fine. It's your choice.
Years ago, they removed God from the public educational system. When I say they removed God, I don't mean religion. I mean they gutted the system of teaching core values and moral accountability. Since then, we have seen how our culture has been debased.
Although everyone is afforded freedom of speech, in the past 15 years or so, there has been a media onslaught to attack anyone who espouses Christians values in this country. You may not believe this. That's fine. There are many examples. There is a double standard in this country.
Phil Robertson is suspended from his family show for only stating his personal beliefs, yet libs like John Podesta, a former Clinton aid, can refer to Conservatives as "Jonestown Cult", he gets a free pass. Christians are ridiculed on TV, in the movies, and in the press. It's allowed because of those with an agenda also control the majority of those venues.
Yet, how dare ONE person state his personal beliefs based on the Bible, and he should be destroyed. Where's the "TOLERANCE"? Oh yea, that's only afforded to NON Christians. It's about standing up for freedom of speech. When you allow a small percentage in the country to dictate what you can express, that is NOT freedom of speech. That is censorship. And the reality is that someone as you who doesn't understand the true message being sent in all of this, will be one of the first to cower when your freedom of speech is



Posted by seraph
I'll reply to this at length once my headache is gone. Might be tomorrow sometime.
But in the meantime, the answer couldn't be simpler: if the network does nothing, they condone homophobia. If they do something, they send a message that's it's unacceptable.
The 1st Amendment is noble in its intent, but absolutely abysmal (too often to ignore) in its execution and invocation. It is regularly trotted out as a means to justify bigotry under the "freedom of expression" war-cry, and people are led to assume that it gives them a license to say whatever the hell they want without repercussion.
The rigidity of Constitutional Amendments (particualry the 1st), means that it is extremely difficult to devise just and reasonable exceptions to them, or at least methods of remedy that don't run afoul of it somehow. But they all do, unfortunately. This is the reason your Supreme Court can't bring itself to catch up with other modern democracies in the area of Hate Speech laws.
Simply put, your 1st Amendment rights don't give you a license to abuse them. Good on the network for doing the right thing. And from a purely pragmatic point of view, it's their show to begin with and they can determine the content and message as they please.


Posted by RabbitPosted by Quest4Water
Saying that employers have every right to ban/fire people for their speech effectively removes the first amendment. The vast majority of Americans are employed, so should every employed citizen be subject to this same treatment? IE, some cashier getting fired from Walmart because of some personal opinions she posted on Facebook? Really? Let's just scrap the first amendment if that's the case.
If you've signed any document as a condition of your employment that states you are to act/speak/represent your employer in a manner consistent with the employers values, and you violate that agreement, then yes.
Don't like it? Don't sign away your right to free speech in exchange for money.click to expand


Posted by Rabbit
It's a harsh reality...but having an employee with controversial views is an extreme liability these days for some companies. Social media has given the average joe the ability to turn molehills into mountains.

Posted by seraphPosted by Quest4Water
But again, and this is to you and Seraph, how do you define which is more important, someone's sexuality vs someone's religious tenets. They are both highly personal and very individual-often volatile in said defense. Indeed, it can and will make mountains of molehills but should that cost peoples their careers or worse?
If religious tenets teach and promote hate, then they fall under the "abuse" category (and are thus open to remedies, accordingly) and need to be used with greater care and mindfulness.click to expand

Posted by size zero superheroPosted by Quest4WaterPosted by Rabbit
It's a harsh reality...but having an employee with controversial views is an extreme liability these days for some companies. Social media has given the average joe the ability to turn molehills into mountains.
But again, and this is to you and Seraph, how do you define which is more important, someone's sexuality vs someone's religious tenets. They are both highly personal and very individual-often volatile in said defense. Indeed, it can and will make mountains of molehills but should that cost peoples their careers or worse?
Sexual preferences are not consciously predetermined, whereas religion & which particular components of faith are emphasized is 100% choice.
Then, there's the issue of how one chooses to incorporate these beliefs--he's free to think this way & apply these standards to his personal life--but that's not enough.
He had to condemn gay people, and wonder out loud, how "a man's anus could take the place of vagina", going on to explain that he feels God & Jesus specifically banned such deviance.click to expand









Posted by Rabbit
FYI...he also said in the same interview that blacks in Louisiana were "happier before civil rights".





Posted by Rabbit
My view is this...I personally don't give two shits about his beliefs. They're his, not mine and he's entitled to them.
But A&E had the right as a private entity to suspend him if he violated terms of his contract by making those remarks in the interview.
That's just the way things work these days especially with media hyper saturation.


Posted by Rabbit
My view is this...I personally don't give two shits about his beliefs. They're his, not mine and he's entitled to them.
But A&E had the right as a private entity to suspend him if he violated terms of his contract by making those remarks in the interview.
That's just the way things work these days especially with media hyper saturation.


Posted by Rabbit
Well, you're right.
If you hire someone from rural Louisiana, don't be surprised when they have the beliefs of someone from rural Louisiana.

Posted by Rabbit
Paula Deen is another one...
If you hire an older lady from the south, and you find out later she (gasp) acts like an older lady from the south....who's fault is that?


Posted by Rabbit
That's because quite a few people in this country are more concerned with what other people are doing/thinking/saying than what they themselves are doing/thinking/saying

Posted by seraph
Incorrect. If he signed a morality clause then he has no legal recourse under the First Amendment. The network owns him in his capacity as talent/actor and can dismiss him based on his violating what he agreed to not violate.
No one violated his right to free speech. He exercised it. And A&E exercised their rights as an employer.
Simple simple, folks.
Posted by seraph
But in the meantime, the answer couldn't be simpler: if the network does nothing, they condone homophobia.click to expand

Posted by seraph
The fact of the matter is that if you think you can't or will not be held accountable for what you say in life, you're in for a a rude (and quite justified) awakening.

Posted by seraph
And yes, he *is* a homophobe, and apparently the network thinks so, too.

Posted by seraph
Ignorance under the mantle of religion is no excuse. Piggybacking bigotry on religion is a common tactic. And it's gratifying to see that there are at least *some* mechanisms out there (in this case a sense of moral responsibility on the part of a network) that can address this.

Posted by seraph
I have no idea what one has to do with the other.
At this point it's obvious that you've taken leave of your senses. Again.

Posted by Rabbit
That's because quite a few people in this country are more concerned with what other people are doing/thinking/saying than what they themselves are doing/thinking/sayingclick to expand
^^^^There's the money quote right there.

Posted by Prince_Pisces
Yeah, apparently this is a big deal LOL! Last time I checked, they were just a bunch of dirty rednecks that lived out in the swamp. Not sure why anyones listening to them in the first place.

Posted by seraphPosted by LetltBPosted by seraph
And yes, he *is* a homophobe, and apparently the network thinks so, too.
WRONG AGAIN *PRINCESS*
ho??mo??pho??bi??a (hm-fb-)
n.
1. Fear of or contempt for lesbians and gay men.
2. Behavior based on such a feeling.
ho??mo??phobe
/??ho?_m—?fo?_b/ Show Spelled [hoh-muh-fohb] Show IPA
noun
a person who fears or hates homosexuals and homosexuality.
Your Canadian dictionary must be different eh? This man spoke of no fear, in fact he should be commended for having the courage to share HIS feelings and opinions. His behavior was not homophobe, and in fact he says he LOVES all mankind. How many more holes you want shot up into your SPIN Seraph?
Ignorance under the mantle of religion is no excuse. Piggybacking bigotry on religion is a common tactic. And it's gratifying to see that there are at least *some* mechanisms out there (in this case a sense of moral responsibility on the part of a network) that can address this.click to expand

Posted by seraph
I think it's rather that I realize that I can't argue with crazy.
You're at that point again where you just end up having a conversation with yourself.

Posted by AriesIntrovert16
Don't they refer to themselves as rednecks?

Posted by Rabbit
The more and more I think about it, the more this whole situation smells like cat shit.
A&E is loving the publicity they are getting.

Posted by Rabbit
And their time is almost up anyways.
When you get a Chia Pet made out of you...you've pretty much jumped the shark.



Posted by Arietteheart
Why are people so fucking confused about freedom of speech? It doesn't protect you from being criticized, suspended or fired...it only protects you from being arrested.
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Link here: http://tv.yahoo.com/blogs/tv-news/-duck-dynasty--drama--controversy-continues-to-build-over-phil-robertson-s-homosexuality-remarks-180934306.html<BR>
I normally entirely disagree with people commenting on sexuality, but I'm not quite sure if the disagreement is based on a religious belief. I would have a different opinion if Phil volunteered his thoughts, but because it was done during an interview I think that changes things.
Thoughts?