Is plastic something we should still be making?
This topic was created in the Miscellaneous forum by poppyflower on Friday, June 2, 2023 and has 24 replies.
I mean, it's good that currently we have laws that eliminated plastic bags in Canada. But still a lot of places and items that use plastic. Plastic containers is still very popular for businesses to use. So even with the reduction in plastic bags, it seems there are still a lot of plastic around.
Plastic is one of the main sources of pollution right now.
Plastic is one of the main sources of pollution right now.
It infuriates me because oil is the most valuable resource that's going to be needed for a very long time and we just waste it on cars and water bottles
My town doesn't even offer any type of recycling. If I wanted to recycle, I'd have to drive my trash 40 miles to a place that does recycling. Like I've stuffed 24 empty water bottles into a trash bag many times and feel like shit every time. Hopefully we get to a point it's cost efficient enough to just blast all our trash towards the sun, and let it be completely incinerated.
Posted by SoulBig oil invented recycling to sell more plastic shit.
My town doesn't even offer any type of recycling. If I wanted to recycle, I'd have to drive my trash 40 miles to a place that does recycling. Like I've stuffed 24 empty water bottles into a trash bag many times and feel like shit every time. Hopefully we get to a point it's cost efficient enough to just blast all our trash towards the sun, and let it be completely incinerated.
We discriminate between stuff you can recycle and stuff you can't recycle. The later is generally sent for incineration as a means of energy production. The plastic you can recycle, like certain bottles or cups, can be brought to the shops were they are sold. In some places you even get back some of the cash you paid when returning the bottles, have seen such system in place in Germany.
Eventhough my project is for creating a circular economy for plastic, finding ways to reuse plastic bags that aren't being recycled and ending up poisoning soil, water and animals, I wish that we encourage alternatives for plastic and stop the production and use of plastic bags like they were never invented in the first place.
It shocks me how we were more thoughtful of the planet in the old days, having water and milk in glass containers (which is way healthier than any other material). It is really up to the packaging of consumer goods, if factories and companies start by that, I believe it will have a huge impact. We need to normalize the use of earth-friendly materials.
It shocks me how we were more thoughtful of the planet in the old days, having water and milk in glass containers (which is way healthier than any other material). It is really up to the packaging of consumer goods, if factories and companies start by that, I believe it will have a huge impact. We need to normalize the use of earth-friendly materials.
Plastic should be illegal yes. You can now make a plastic from hemp but it’s more expensive so they say, so it very rare you’ll even see it sadly. But it’s actually biodegradable. The thing is, there’s also pollution and waste just making these things. So do we really NEED all this “convenient” stuff??
Posted by alexscariesThis is very likely because plastic can turn into micro particles that we can't see.. it is a shame really how we can't find an effective solution to fix the mess we made to our planet 🤦🏻♀️Posted by TxOgal
Eventhough my project is for creating a circular economy for plastic, finding ways to reuse plastic bags that aren't being recycled and ending up poisoning soil, water and animals, I wish that we encourage alternatives for plastic and stop the production and use of plastic bags like they were never invented in the first place.
It shocks me how we were more thoughtful of the planet in the old days, having water and milk in glass containers (which is way healthier than any other material). It is really up to the packaging of consumer goods, if factories and companies start by that, I believe it will have a huge impact. We need to normalize the use of earth-friendly materials.
Here's another shocker I recently learnt very few places can recycle Tetrapak cartons. There was a film I think it was Mondovino about a French Vineyard who imported lots of rubbish to fertilise the soil - things like egg shells and rotten veg are really good, what they found is there was lots of plastic in it which actually made it worse.click to expand
Posted by DKThere were bottle depots in Alberta. I use to actively take plastic bottles to those depots for cash while I was living there. I don't get why other provinces don't follow this.
We discriminate between stuff you can recycle and stuff you can't recycle. The later is generally sent for incineration as a means of energy production. The plastic you can recycle, like certain bottles or cups, can be brought to the shops were they are sold. In some places you even get back some of the cash you paid when returning the bottles, have seen such system in place in Germany.
Posted by TxOgalProblem is, I think, that other materials are more expensive. Glass bottles and containers are so much better than plastic, but they break much more easily too. So until those materials get more cost effective, companies will still use plastic because it's cheaper.
Eventhough my project is for creating a circular economy for plastic, finding ways to reuse plastic bags that aren't being recycled and ending up poisoning soil, water and animals, I wish that we encourage alternatives for plastic and stop the production and use of plastic bags like they were never invented in the first place.
It shocks me how we were more thoughtful of the planet in the old days, having water and milk in glass containers (which is way healthier than any other material). It is really up to the packaging of consumer goods, if factories and companies start by that, I believe it will have a huge impact. We need to normalize the use of earth-friendly materials.
Posted by AbbyNormalNope. But you can just hear the uproar from people if the price went up further cuz the packaging got more expensive. 😔
Plastic should be illegal yes. You can now make a plastic from hemp but it’s more expensive so they say, so it very rare you’ll even see it sadly. But it’s actually biodegradable. The thing is, there’s also pollution and waste just making these things. So do we really NEED all this “convenient” stuff??
Companies uses cheap materials in the name of keeping prices down. A lot of consumers don't want to change that as long as the prices are kept low.
It would probably do me a little justice if plastic bottles stop being made cus people don't want to recycle right. And now having my own recycling business is tough. And what's more I don't even have much earth in my chart if any if you wanna call an earth sign being in a far off distant planet a strong one. It's not heavy at all in my chart and I still care to recycle, the right way.
Posted by StubbornSagI know of one company where to produces and packages milk in glass bottles. They charge a $ 2 CAD bottle deposit that consumers get back when they return the bottles. Then there's this:
I keep saying plastic bags mean nothing compared to everything else made from it. Ok you take your bag with you instead of buying plastic one. And then you buy all those products packed in plastic packing...what's the point then? Plastic should be returnable like it used to be before with glass. Simply give reduced costs for returning packaging or pay people for returning it. But that's not going to be applied ofc because production of plastic is an industry on it's own obviously and it brings a lot of money too so... That problem needs to be solved from it's core - production. Offer these solutions but also put higher taxes on production, so that it's not that desirable as it is now. Simply awareness needs to be raised on every side. Not just consumer, but producer too. And those who don't want to be aware should pay higher tolls for it then at least
https://frontiergroup.org/resources/the-return-of-returnable-packaging-new-takes-on-an-old-idea-are-reducing-plastic-waste/
But not enough are doing this.
If all the Provinces were recycling there wouldn't be so much waste. I was kinda surprised when I found out that a lot of Provinces do not recycle.
Honestly, I feel like all the things made to replace plastic are making the problem worse. Everyone had such a problem with plastic bags and starws so they just created new bags and straws.. but they don't last forever, they are also being discarded.. at least the plastic bags and straws could be RECYCLED!! So since people don't want to recycle, more crap is being created to replace them and it's also adding to the landfill.
Honestly, I feel like all the things made to replace plastic are making the problem worse. Everyone had such a problem with plastic bags and starws so they just created new bags and straws.. but they don't last forever, they are also being discarded.. at least the plastic bags and straws could be RECYCLED!! So since people don't want to recycle, more crap is being created to replace them and it's also adding to the landfill.
Posted by whiplashSupposedly the newer materials are compostable. I can only hope they don’t make more non-compostable waste by trying to make these new materials.
If all the Provinces were recycling there wouldn't be so much waste. I was kinda surprised when I found out that a lot of Provinces do not recycle.
Honestly, I feel like all the things made to replace plastic are making the problem worse. Everyone had such a problem with plastic bags and starws so they just created new bags and straws.. but they don't last forever, they are also being discarded.. at least the plastic bags and straws could be RECYCLED!! So since people don't want to recycle, more crap is being created to replace them and it's also adding to the landfill.
I don’t get why Ontario don’t have bottle depots. It’s not gonna get everyone to recycle but I bet a lot more bottles will get recycled this way.
Plastic isn't recycled at all. Most of the time they just shred it into tiny particles and they use it to coat roads or sport tracks or to make fake concrete blocs. Sometimes they use this fake concrete as landfill to gain land over the sea. In all cases it's just turned into tiny platic that's disseminated everywhere.
That said most of the pseudo ecologism nowadays is just propaganda disseminated by big corpos to their owned media, in order to profit from the malthusianist prison-world that the mafia is trying to impose.
If they're trash-talking plastic, you can be sure they have a shekel to make by putting limitations or sthg
That said most of the pseudo ecologism nowadays is just propaganda disseminated by big corpos to their owned media, in order to profit from the malthusianist prison-world that the mafia is trying to impose.
If they're trash-talking plastic, you can be sure they have a shekel to make by putting limitations or sthg
Yes, we should. Collect all used one and convert it into fuel.
Posted by UndineSeems a lot of it are just being shredded into tiny particles of plastic that possibly ends up in the soil or water, instead of their other potentials. Even though they can be converted to fuel, it seems people aren't choosing to do so right now.
Yes, we should. Collect all used one and convert it into fuel.
Posted by poppyflowerNo, converting plastic back to petrol would involve melting it (pyrolysis). The technology already exists. Like any other process, it could be optimised xxx fold and used on a larger scale. The fact that the governments are not pushing for it, or even subsidising its further development, suggests that the plastic pollution is not such a big issue and priority, at least not for them.Posted by Undine
Yes, we should. Collect all used one and convert it into fuel.
Seems a lot of it are just being shredded into tiny particles of plastic that possibly ends up in the soil or water, instead of their other potentials. Even though they can be converted to fuel, it seems people aren't choosing to do so right now.click to expand
I was born behind the "iron curtain", aka in one of the former socialist countries, at a time when no or little plastics were used in their economy. Since I was send to do the shopping --on my own!--from like 5 years old (another blessing of living in communism) I remember well how it was done.
So here is what the pre-plastic era looked like:
--Food supermarkets/malls could not exist in the extensive form we know today. This is because things like meat, poultry, fish, sweets, etc, were not on the shelves, since they were NOT wrapped. You had to buy them from a butcher instead, who cut and handled the meat with latex gloves and wrapped it in a cellophane sheet (a non-stretching, noisy, single use sheet which was made from cellulose extracted from plants from the Danube Delta). If the meat was fresh, blood would be leaking out of the wrap, all over your bag.
-You had to go shopping with clean, empty jars and glass bottles as an exchange for the ones you were buying (otherwise you had to pay for the glass, which many times was more expensive than the product).
-Fruits and vegetables were full of dirt, practically dug up and put on shelves in small containers. You had to handle them yourself, and it took a while to clean them at home and the woven bag you had for shopping.
In summary.....It was dirty, unhygenic and, most importantly, not scalable.
So here is what the pre-plastic era looked like:
--Food supermarkets/malls could not exist in the extensive form we know today. This is because things like meat, poultry, fish, sweets, etc, were not on the shelves, since they were NOT wrapped. You had to buy them from a butcher instead, who cut and handled the meat with latex gloves and wrapped it in a cellophane sheet (a non-stretching, noisy, single use sheet which was made from cellulose extracted from plants from the Danube Delta). If the meat was fresh, blood would be leaking out of the wrap, all over your bag.
-You had to go shopping with clean, empty jars and glass bottles as an exchange for the ones you were buying (otherwise you had to pay for the glass, which many times was more expensive than the product).
-Fruits and vegetables were full of dirt, practically dug up and put on shelves in small containers. You had to handle them yourself, and it took a while to clean them at home and the woven bag you had for shopping.
In summary.....It was dirty, unhygenic and, most importantly, not scalable.
I have forgotten to mention the worst thing: there were queues everywhere! Because you couldn't just grab many of the products from the shelves (they were not wrapped, therefore not on the shelves). You had to wait in a queue by the butcher to be served with a piece of meat, sometimes for 1+ hrs.
Posted by poppyflowerOh really?? I didn't realize that Ont didn't even do the bottle deposits. I thought it was just the normal recycling they didn't do. You're right, a lot more bottles would get recycled if they adopted that atleast.Posted by whiplash
If all the Provinces were recycling there wouldn't be so much waste. I was kinda surprised when I found out that a lot of Provinces do not recycle.
Honestly, I feel like all the things made to replace plastic are making the problem worse. Everyone had such a problem with plastic bags and starws so they just created new bags and straws.. but they don't last forever, they are also being discarded.. at least the plastic bags and straws could be RECYCLED!! So since people don't want to recycle, more crap is being created to replace them and it's also adding to the landfill.
Supposedly the newer materials are compostable. I can only hope they don’t make more non-compostable waste by trying to make these new materials.
I don’t get why Ontario don’t have bottle depots. It’s not gonna get everyone to recycle but I bet a lot more bottles will get recycled this way.click to expand
Posted by UndineYeah, there's probably no way for properly sealing meat and seafood without using plastic. Paper bag is good until it comes in contact with water. So it's probably not really that good with wet meat and seafood.
I was born behind the "iron curtain", aka in one of the former socialist countries, at a time when no or little plastics were used in their economy. Since I was send to do the shopping --on my own!--from like 5 years old (another blessing of living in communism) I remember well how it was done.
So here is what the pre-plastic era looked like:
--Food supermarkets/malls could not exist in the extensive form we know today. This is because things like meat, poultry, fish, sweets, etc, were not on the shelves, since they were NOT wrapped. You had to buy them from a butcher instead, who cut and handled the meat with latex gloves and wrapped it in a cellophane sheet (a non-stretching, noisy, single use sheet which was made from cellulose extracted from plants from the Danube Delta). If the meat was fresh, blood would be leaking out of the wrap, all over your bag.
-You had to go shopping with clean, empty jars and glass bottles as an exchange for the ones you were buying (otherwise you had to pay for the glass, which many times was more expensive than the product).
-Fruits and vegetables were full of dirt, practically dug up and put on shelves in small containers. You had to handle them yourself, and it took a while to clean them at home and the woven bag you had for shopping.
In summary.....It was dirty, unhygenic and, most importantly, not scalable.
The empty jars and glass bottles sounds like what's happening with charging bottle deposit and you get that deposit back if you return the bottles. It's a big thing in some places already and people do actually take the trouble of bringing the bottles in to get their money. A lot of vegetables and fruits don't come in plastic packaging anymore. The plastic bags intended for customers to use for fruits and vegetables are often used by people who don't want to buy reusable bags.
Maybe not completely get rid of plastic, but there are areas where I'm not sure we really need to use plastic.
Posted by UndineProbably not for the governments, but that doesn't mean it's not a big issue.Posted by poppyflowerPosted by Undine
Yes, we should. Collect all used one and convert it into fuel.
Seems a lot of it are just being shredded into tiny particles of plastic that possibly ends up in the soil or water, instead of their other potentials. Even though they can be converted to fuel, it seems people aren't choosing to do so right now.
click to expand
No, converting plastic back to petrol would involve melting it (pyrolysis). The technology already exists. Like any other process, it could be optimised xxx fold and used on a larger scale. The fact that the governments are not pushing for it, or even subsidising its further development, suggests that the plastic pollution is not such a big issue and priority, at least not for them.click to expand
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