borednbeautiful
@borednbeautiful
3 Years1,000+ Posts
Comments: 11190 · Posts: 4240 · Topics: 55
Free will vs Predestination
You mean all this time I never thought of as people having free will to kill? How stupid of me smh.
I think I'm destined. I was born a pretty baby (I wish I still had that picture) and even as an adult still managed to keep it. Was always a pretty boy so beauty runs deep in me, naturally. I mean I'm not perfect I'm no better than the rest I just keep it real and just be myself. Sometimes I do wish I was born rich and ugly instead of good looking and poor.
As far as which one I believe in, I don't know. That's a hard one for me to call. I hope I didn't get carried away and go off topic with my little rant.
I think I'm destined. I was born a pretty baby (I wish I still had that picture) and even as an adult still managed to keep it. Was always a pretty boy so beauty runs deep in me, naturally. I mean I'm not perfect I'm no better than the rest I just keep it real and just be myself. Sometimes I do wish I was born rich and ugly instead of good looking and poor.
As far as which one I believe in, I don't know. That's a hard one for me to call. I hope I didn't get carried away and go off topic with my little rant.
Posted by Jumpin_Jupiter
You mean all this time I never thought of as people having free will to kill? How stupid of me smh.
I think I'm destined. I was born a pretty baby (I wish I still had that picture) and even as an adult still managed to keep it. Was always a pretty boy so beauty runs deep in me, naturally. I mean I'm not perfect I'm no better than the rest I just keep it real and just be myself. Sometimes I do wish I was born rich and ugly instead of good looking and poor.
As far as which one I believe in, I don't know. That's a hard one for me to call. I hope I didn't get carried away and go off topic with my little rant.
Predestined. In the beauty scene.
Posted by DewiK91Posted by borednbeautiful
Which one do you believe in?
Something has been weighing heavily on my mind lately. If we truly have free will, how come some people are born with (predestined) certain talents or great beauty or huge inheritance?
I know people who pretty much didn’t have to lift a finger in their life. Everything fell in their lap with no trouble.
I know others who even though they had a free will and good will, nothing worked in their favor. I actually know a family of 4 who all died in a tragic accident when a drunk driver hit them. They were on their way to a family vacation. How is it a free will to choose something like this? It doesn’t make sense.
I believe in reincarnation and karma and i also believe that some people have to go through the struggle to test their resilience and strength, that they either walk the right path or the wrong path.
It is not always fair but i do believe we all have a purpose on this planetclick to expand
Yes. I struggled with this purpose concept, but I’m trying to make some sense of it. So I’ve been listening to many podcasts, reading about different religions and beliefs, philosophy, psychology, etc.
They say no one is burdened with what they can’t bear. At least that sounds somewhat hopeful. Maybe we just don’t understand from this point of human existence and evolution.
Posted by Jumpin_Jupiter
You mean all this time I never thought of as people having free will to kill? How stupid of me smh.
I think I'm destined. I was born a pretty baby (I wish I still had that picture) and even as an adult still managed to keep it. Was always a pretty boy so beauty runs deep in me, naturally. I mean I'm not perfect I'm no better than the rest I just keep it real and just be myself. Sometimes I do wish I was born rich and ugly instead of good looking and poor.
As far as which one I believe in, I don't know. That's a hard one for me to call. I hope I didn't get carried away and go off topic with my little rant.
You are fine. It’s confusing 🫤
I am not sure which one I believe either.
Posted by borednbeautiful
Which one do you believe in?
Something has been weighing heavily on my mind lately. If we truly have free will, how come some people are born with (predestined) certain talents or great beauty or huge inheritance?
I know people who pretty much didn’t have to lift a finger in their life. Everything fell in their lap with no trouble.
I know others who even though they had a free will and good will, nothing worked in their favor. I actually know a family of 4 who all died in a tragic accident when a drunk driver hit them. They were on their way to a family vacation. How is it a free will to choose something like this? It doesn’t make sense.
Oohh this is a deep subject, hardcore rabit hole,
Spiritual extrastential stuff 🤩
Have you ever considered both concepts are fully at play?
So much is subjective in the human experience...
Born to a wealthy family a couple million isn't much.
Couple million to my own life style and needs. I could easily be set for life in addition to buying houses for my mom and siblings.
And yet that person who was born into wealth will have thier own struggles and experiences.
Imagine the pressure applied to you to succeed and to pull it off at that level. That's the high roller table.
As far as tragic events...shit happens and people may not necessarily be at fault, or pre-planned it.
For the soul...if your death/trauma/tragedy/challenging event led to something objective good/better.....
I know it "sounds" like a Callous mentality with this, but it's not. What I'm trying to give example to is everything has meaning!
Life and existence has purpose and meaning, which in large part has a lot to do with the experience itself.
There is a lot to be said about what is possible in whatever situation you and your life is it.
It just people typically don't do things differently for a different outcome or experience in life.
People will fight tooth in nail to hold on to people and situations that are horrible and make them miserable....until shit hits the fan forcing them too.
The whole blessing in disguise phenomenon is a trip.
Bsck the the whole " There is a lot to be said about what is possible in whatever situation you and your life is it."
Seriously... so much possibilties and options are around, just not looking for it or willing to walk away from what they are currently doing to take the risks.
Lmao how many people do you know don't like or hate their job?
Yet, how many of those actually do something about it?🙇
There is so many options and experiences and by extent free will, how much of what is holding them back from expressing free will actualky themselves vs. External factors?☺️
It's a bit of both.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
Posted by Undine
It's a bit of both.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
I read somewhere that life is like a movie, where Creator/God/Higher Power knows the ending, but doesn’t interfere.
So supposedly we have free will in some aspects, but not in others.
It’s a difficult concept to grasp but I’m working on it.
Both are true.
There's divine intervention sometimes, or maybe angelic beings are capable of reading minds/feelings. Then the intervention comes because you had the thought in the first place?
Freewill can still exist if your ignorant to predestination.
Does the mouse know it's in a maze?
There's divine intervention sometimes, or maybe angelic beings are capable of reading minds/feelings. Then the intervention comes because you had the thought in the first place?
Freewill can still exist if your ignorant to predestination.
Does the mouse know it's in a maze?
Posted by borednbeautifulPosted by Undine
It's a bit of both.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
I read somewhere that life is like a movie, where Creator/God/Higher Power knows the ending, but doesn’t interfere.
So supposedly we have free will in some aspects, but not in others.
It’s a difficult concept to grasp but I’m working on it.click to expand
God is now scratching his over-kissed arse, full of excitement, preparing to watch us going to bed...
Watch but don't touch, pervert!
Posted by UndinePosted by borednbeautifulPosted by Undine
It's a bit of both.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
I read somewhere that life is like a movie, where Creator/God/Higher Power knows the ending, but doesn’t interfere.
So supposedly we have free will in some aspects, but not in others.
It’s a difficult concept to grasp but I’m working on it.
God is now scratching his over-kissed arse, full of excitement, preparing to watch us going to bed...
Watch but don't touch, pervert!click to expand
Chuckles 🤭
You'd be surprised how much of what we assume is free will and coincidence is actually determined. Classical laws of physics are deterministic. Quantum physics leave some room for random events though.
Say you kick a football and you had the exact measurements of where the football was when you kicked it, the surrounding air molecules' exact positions and movements, etc. you'd be able to predict the exact position of where the ball would fall.
So if you had a powerful enough quantum computer that had the capacity to "run" the entire universe, based on the movement of molecules, atoms, etc. from a specific starting point - you'd be able to predict exactly how every single thing plays out - past, present & future (altough time doesn't really exist, lol). Just like the butterfly effect, one thing catapults the next into motion and so forth in an unbreakable chain. Every decision is still a product of these forces, it's just that we aren't able to measure them deterministically, hence the illusion of free will.
You'd literally need a quantum computer more powerful than all the combined energy of the universe.
In any way, the more I read the less I believe in free will. In fact the idea seems quite ridiculous.
Example, going back to the football.... when you kick the ball, you don't know where it will land exctly, but that process has already been set in motion and it is predestined to land in a very specific place based on the surrounding environment which could have been calculated with a big enough computer. We could go further back... how hard you kick the ball is in turn determined by X,Y, and Z and so forth (or back) until the beginning of the universe.
I think there's something to be said about how we confuse the concept of time with free will.
Say you kick a football and you had the exact measurements of where the football was when you kicked it, the surrounding air molecules' exact positions and movements, etc. you'd be able to predict the exact position of where the ball would fall.
So if you had a powerful enough quantum computer that had the capacity to "run" the entire universe, based on the movement of molecules, atoms, etc. from a specific starting point - you'd be able to predict exactly how every single thing plays out - past, present & future (altough time doesn't really exist, lol). Just like the butterfly effect, one thing catapults the next into motion and so forth in an unbreakable chain. Every decision is still a product of these forces, it's just that we aren't able to measure them deterministically, hence the illusion of free will.
You'd literally need a quantum computer more powerful than all the combined energy of the universe.
In any way, the more I read the less I believe in free will. In fact the idea seems quite ridiculous.
Example, going back to the football.... when you kick the ball, you don't know where it will land exctly, but that process has already been set in motion and it is predestined to land in a very specific place based on the surrounding environment which could have been calculated with a big enough computer. We could go further back... how hard you kick the ball is in turn determined by X,Y, and Z and so forth (or back) until the beginning of the universe.
I think there's something to be said about how we confuse the concept of time with free will.
This is kind of a hard concept to write out, but how do you know when don't each live on a different spectrum? One that can be changed, or altered at any point in time? Like I'm not so egocentric that I think other people don't exist. I just feel like every single tiny little thing that happens in my life was a reaction from something I've done in the past. Good or bad. I truly feel all the good and bad that happens in the entire world is all because of my actions, and the end results will be how well I can adapt and change through my person life. Except all life is experiencing their own similar reality at the same time. I've been trying to word this concept for a long time, and hope either I or someone else can put it into better worlds one day. I don't want to go the simulation route, but I feel like existing is like a sandbox game. You can get all the good or bad traits in the world, but you still have to play the game. Your actions and the way you live will change the end results. The idea of life, reality, and the world being one big sand box is what makes it free will. People who have natural talent or inherited wealth don't necessarily have the skill or even the thought process to think outside the box. Something as basic as using natural resources to build a bridge to cleaner water might be trivial.
Posted by borednbeautiful
Which one do you believe in?
Something has been weighing heavily on my mind lately. If we truly have free will, how come some people are born with (predestined) certain talents or great beauty or huge inheritance?
How do you figure that is predestined as oppose to the opposite? I'm really not following your logic.
I think it's predetermined. Our environmental factors, mental conditioning and genetics are too strong, we have the illusion of free will but not actual free will.
The more time passes, the more I feel like everything's a cosmic roll of the dice. I'm not much of a gambling personality.
But maybe it's coz of the unusual streak of luck I've been experiencing since the end of last year. Last days of 2023, I got multiple texts and phone calls from what I thought at first was some scammy telemarketer that turned out to be something I've won for a service I've availed ONCE from some company over the holidays. 1 in 59,999 chances and I won.
Beginning of 2024, I went out for a quick run to the store for some fruit and again I won in one of the mini games I wasn't even taking seriously and came home with definitely MORE than fruits.
And not too long after that, I found the much-coveted collector's item on the FIRST box I bought of this cookie brand that's running some kind of all-expense paid trip somewhere.
Few days ago, I got this text about being the winner of some gift card (some popular shopping mall). And just a day after that, I won pretty much in the same place I won that prize of 1 in 59,999. Like what are the odds it's the same company? Then I bought these 2 snack packs and you know what? Both of them won me each a ticket for a free 'dining experience for 2' to some nice rooftop bar.
BUT when I tried to intentionally seek out this luck thinking that I can ride it like a wave by buying 10 tickets to something I thought I had some kinda 'super power' to win, I fell flat on my face coz I lost EACH TIME.
But maybe it's coz of the unusual streak of luck I've been experiencing since the end of last year. Last days of 2023, I got multiple texts and phone calls from what I thought at first was some scammy telemarketer that turned out to be something I've won for a service I've availed ONCE from some company over the holidays. 1 in 59,999 chances and I won.
Beginning of 2024, I went out for a quick run to the store for some fruit and again I won in one of the mini games I wasn't even taking seriously and came home with definitely MORE than fruits.
And not too long after that, I found the much-coveted collector's item on the FIRST box I bought of this cookie brand that's running some kind of all-expense paid trip somewhere.
Few days ago, I got this text about being the winner of some gift card (some popular shopping mall). And just a day after that, I won pretty much in the same place I won that prize of 1 in 59,999. Like what are the odds it's the same company? Then I bought these 2 snack packs and you know what? Both of them won me each a ticket for a free 'dining experience for 2' to some nice rooftop bar.
BUT when I tried to intentionally seek out this luck thinking that I can ride it like a wave by buying 10 tickets to something I thought I had some kinda 'super power' to win, I fell flat on my face coz I lost EACH TIME.
Posted by borednbeautiful
Which one do you believe in?
Both of them. Free will are the choices we make with what we are pre-destined to do.
I've always been of the belief that: prepare for the worst and always hope for the best.
And you always have free will to fuck things up if you're not careful. Even when things are going to shit, you can try to work things out in your favor still. As long as you don't lose ALL hope.
Because if you lose all hope, then nothing else matters anymore.
And you always have free will to fuck things up if you're not careful. Even when things are going to shit, you can try to work things out in your favor still. As long as you don't lose ALL hope.
Because if you lose all hope, then nothing else matters anymore.
Both.
Boiled down to very basics, rather like the movie final destination. If something is meant to happen, you might make a choice that helps you avoid it short term but it will happen long term. That's for good bad and neutral things. However, if you keep being "offered" a chance and find a way to avoid it or fuck it up, you might lose it even if it was supposed to happen. Then that experience gets added to things you will experience in your next life.
I think the book The Five People You Meet In Heaven touches on it too. What might seem random or inconsequential to you might be profound for another. Like that time you took too long at a traffic light might mean the person behind you missed an accident, or, was in one. Butterfly effect, your choices/actions don't only effect you. Like you didn't proceed immediately when the light turned because for some reason your car died and you had to restart it. Odd, it's never done that before...but you drive home and nothing else happens. So to you it was a random occurrence. But the guy behind you was that half a minute later going through another intersection...and either missed the car that blew a red light or was there when it did. Was it random? Were you used as a pawn in the universes "game" as it fulfilled an outcome in that guys life? There's a big rabbit hole here lol.
Boiled down to very basics, rather like the movie final destination. If something is meant to happen, you might make a choice that helps you avoid it short term but it will happen long term. That's for good bad and neutral things. However, if you keep being "offered" a chance and find a way to avoid it or fuck it up, you might lose it even if it was supposed to happen. Then that experience gets added to things you will experience in your next life.
I think the book The Five People You Meet In Heaven touches on it too. What might seem random or inconsequential to you might be profound for another. Like that time you took too long at a traffic light might mean the person behind you missed an accident, or, was in one. Butterfly effect, your choices/actions don't only effect you. Like you didn't proceed immediately when the light turned because for some reason your car died and you had to restart it. Odd, it's never done that before...but you drive home and nothing else happens. So to you it was a random occurrence. But the guy behind you was that half a minute later going through another intersection...and either missed the car that blew a red light or was there when it did. Was it random? Were you used as a pawn in the universes "game" as it fulfilled an outcome in that guys life? There's a big rabbit hole here lol.
Posted by borednbeautifulPosted by Undine
It's a bit of both.
Like an actor taking on a vaguely pre-defined role, but he'll have to improvise his lines.
I read somewhere that life is like a movie, where Creator/God/Higher Power knows the ending, but doesn’t interfere.
So supposedly we have free will in some aspects, but not in others.
It’s a difficult concept to grasp but I’m working on it.click to expand
I believe in a designed life path, but we still have a free will.
The choices we make in life help us to also grow, including the painful ones. The path might veer to the left or to the right, and even split but eventually I will reach my final destination.
I will have many paths, obstacles, roadblocks and even set backs all due to my free will and in the end.... it's where I am supposed to be.
"Life's Blueprint"
I don't like the term because it's loaded because of this debate, but predestination essentialy
Marcus Zuckerburg Aurelius gave a great argument,
essentially if you consider the laws of chemistry and physics and all that, we are all spiraling along according to the laws of nature
The notion of free-will is real, but ultimately we will pick what we are made to do
in some sense, we are animals and free will might be nothing more than our recognition of trying to figure it out
we are built as puzzle-solvers in a sense, but I'm not settled on this debate...
Marcus Zuckerburg Aurelius gave a great argument,
essentially if you consider the laws of chemistry and physics and all that, we are all spiraling along according to the laws of nature
The notion of free-will is real, but ultimately we will pick what we are made to do
in some sense, we are animals and free will might be nothing more than our recognition of trying to figure it out
we are built as puzzle-solvers in a sense, but I'm not settled on this debate...
I believe that all things are predestined, even if they don't end up happening. The reason events occur is because of a build-up of knock-on events that lead up to it. Everything happens by cause and effect, never by pure chance. Even if there are 10 years of causes and effects leading up to something, it was still predestined by them all, regardless of how small or large the event is. The time leading up to it doesn't matter. Well, the time does matter when I want look at the probabilities of things happening, because the closer things are to the future, the greater the chance probability we can see them happening for sure, because there are less chances of cause and effect events changing what's mapped out. Less time for more things to change. Smaller events are also more subject to changes than bigger events.
Free will is one of the major factors that play a role in changes towards what's already predetermined. There are always chances of several different things (paths of occurrences) happening, with a top few having the greatest percentage probability. Whatever we choose to do/ how we choose to act will determine which ones play out. Unless they are natural disasters, it's all based on free will anyway.
So I say both.
Free will is one of the major factors that play a role in changes towards what's already predetermined. There are always chances of several different things (paths of occurrences) happening, with a top few having the greatest percentage probability. Whatever we choose to do/ how we choose to act will determine which ones play out. Unless they are natural disasters, it's all based on free will anyway.
So I say both.
It’s a little of both, but I believe free will takes precedence where the choices we make affect our lives.
You either find out who you are or try to be someone you're not. That's the only choice you have
You have the free will to choose between variations of a predetermined path.
Posted by victoria-sakura
You have the free will to choose between variations of a predetermined path.
this is a good way of looking at it, we are puzzle-solvers but i'm always taking the most natural option, after processing all the sensory/imaginary inputs
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Something has been weighing heavily on my mind lately. If we truly have free will, how come some people are born with (predestined) certain talents or great beauty or huge inheritance?
I know people who pretty much didn’t have to lift a finger in their life. Everything fell in their lap with no trouble.
I know others who even though they had a free will and good will, nothing worked in their favor. I actually know a family of 4 who all died in a tragic accident when a drunk driver hit them. They were on their way to a family vacation. How is it a free will to choose something like this? It doesn’t make sense.