GemGal / VirGuy - Opinions or insight please?
This topic was created in the Virgo forum by GeminiJuneAnn on Wednesday, April 16, 2008 and has 19 replies.
We started dating about 2 1/2 yrs ago. Lived 3 hours apart...long distance and ok with both of us. Became "exclusive" a little over a year ago and all that goes with that. Committed to each other and seeing each other every weekend and sometimes during the week. I have 2 kids (10 & 12) so my first priority is to them and told VirGuy that I will not be able to move from my town because I would not uproot my kids...he understood and we had a plan to have him move to my town, get married, etc.
The company he works for is affiliated with my occupation and that's how we met years ago. We thought there might be a contractual conflict with us dating but was not sure so we did not broadcast this to everyone. Jan 1 of this year my occupation changed definitively removing that possible conflict so we have been waiting for this before he would move here (he travels alot in his job so 3 hours away wouldn't be a big deal). On Feb 9, HR investigated him for some reason that turned out to be a non-issue but found me in the process and now we found out that as an "officer" of the compnay vs employee he cannot date anyone affiliated and had 2 choices...severance pkg or relocation and demotion in a different position. He told HR the conflict has been removed but they said "what about 6 mos ago?" Anyway, he took the demotion..been with the company 24 years and trying to hold out for the good retirement pkg. As of Mar 10, he's 700 miles away and has to travel 80% of his time which is not in my area at all. He also had to take about a 50k paycut.
He makes his last child support pymt next month..his son going to college in the fall and his ex-wife(7 yrs ago) now has to sell the house because he will no longer be paying c/s so he's doubly worried about his kids (18 & 20 yrs). His world is being turned upside down...
Last week he tells me out of the blue that we just can't be together. He doesn't see how to make it happen anymore. At least when he was 3 hrs away he had hope and a plan. He says it's unfair to me. He says he loves me and there's not anything I did so to speak. I say, we can stick it out and he doesn't see how we can.
I'm totally crushed. If you love someone like I know he does, how do you just break it off like that? Since we no longer have an actual "plan" does the Virgo nature to solve the problem only see breaking it off as a solution?
With me being a Gem, I need to understand this better. I can
The company he works for is affiliated with my occupation and that's how we met years ago. We thought there might be a contractual conflict with us dating but was not sure so we did not broadcast this to everyone. Jan 1 of this year my occupation changed definitively removing that possible conflict so we have been waiting for this before he would move here (he travels alot in his job so 3 hours away wouldn't be a big deal). On Feb 9, HR investigated him for some reason that turned out to be a non-issue but found me in the process and now we found out that as an "officer" of the compnay vs employee he cannot date anyone affiliated and had 2 choices...severance pkg or relocation and demotion in a different position. He told HR the conflict has been removed but they said "what about 6 mos ago?" Anyway, he took the demotion..been with the company 24 years and trying to hold out for the good retirement pkg. As of Mar 10, he's 700 miles away and has to travel 80% of his time which is not in my area at all. He also had to take about a 50k paycut.
He makes his last child support pymt next month..his son going to college in the fall and his ex-wife(7 yrs ago) now has to sell the house because he will no longer be paying c/s so he's doubly worried about his kids (18 & 20 yrs). His world is being turned upside down...
Last week he tells me out of the blue that we just can't be together. He doesn't see how to make it happen anymore. At least when he was 3 hrs away he had hope and a plan. He says it's unfair to me. He says he loves me and there's not anything I did so to speak. I say, we can stick it out and he doesn't see how we can.
I'm totally crushed. If you love someone like I know he does, how do you just break it off like that? Since we no longer have an actual "plan" does the Virgo nature to solve the problem only see breaking it off as a solution?
With me being a Gem, I need to understand this better. I can
I can't talk with him again until this weekend as his new position is requiring all of his attention and he needs to focus on that at the moment...
I would appreciate any comments, questions, insight, etc... I'm trying to understand and completely heart-broken
I would appreciate any comments, questions, insight, etc... I'm trying to understand and completely heart-broken
He also has interviewed with a company near me but as he says my choice of town (small in the country) really limits his career opportunities.
To clarify, this was not a mixing of personal / professional relationship. We did not work together and I did not work for him.
GJAnn ... quite a few things pop into my head while reading about this situation .. some good, some bad, some just observations about the Virgo's nature.
First .. the Virgo is very commited to their jobs in life. For him to be reprimanded and demoted in his career is HUGE .. frigging tremendous for him to endure. This is something you must keep in mind. You had said, "If you love someone like I know he does, how do you just break it off like that? Since we no longer have an actual "plan" does the Virgo nature to solve the problem only see breaking it off as a solution?" .. and I get the impression by you saying this, that you aren't understanding how devastatingly this demotion has caused him to suffer. This is a life-altering event to a person who is so career oriented ... it's not to be taken lightly.
You have to put this into perspective. You are thinking that you should be top priority in his life and that he should jump hurdles, and sacrifice anything for you ... and that is asking a lot when it comes to a Virgo's job.
It sounds to me that he still wants you in his life, for a Virgo doesn't make rash decisions when it comes to their love life. They thoroughly reason-out who is a suited partner for them .. and if he has been sneaking behind HR, and making plans for your future, and making that trip to see you .... then you can carry that to the bank that he's sincere about how he feels about you. I wouldn't worry about whether he still wants you or not.
Something I'm not quite getting here .. it appears to me that he has done most of the effort in this. He takes a 50k pay-cut (a lot of damn money), he takes demotion, he makes the travel to see you, he even considers moving to your town though realizes it would put him at an even lower status career-wise ... while you sit back and haven't made any effort in changing your life around to accommodate him.
You said it's because you have kids ... kids are adaptable .. in fact, change is good for kids once in a while, so they can learn diversity.
This is a two-way road here .. partnerships are about compromising.
First .. the Virgo is very commited to their jobs in life. For him to be reprimanded and demoted in his career is HUGE .. frigging tremendous for him to endure. This is something you must keep in mind. You had said, "If you love someone like I know he does, how do you just break it off like that? Since we no longer have an actual "plan" does the Virgo nature to solve the problem only see breaking it off as a solution?" .. and I get the impression by you saying this, that you aren't understanding how devastatingly this demotion has caused him to suffer. This is a life-altering event to a person who is so career oriented ... it's not to be taken lightly.
You have to put this into perspective. You are thinking that you should be top priority in his life and that he should jump hurdles, and sacrifice anything for you ... and that is asking a lot when it comes to a Virgo's job.
It sounds to me that he still wants you in his life, for a Virgo doesn't make rash decisions when it comes to their love life. They thoroughly reason-out who is a suited partner for them .. and if he has been sneaking behind HR, and making plans for your future, and making that trip to see you .... then you can carry that to the bank that he's sincere about how he feels about you. I wouldn't worry about whether he still wants you or not.
Something I'm not quite getting here .. it appears to me that he has done most of the effort in this. He takes a 50k pay-cut (a lot of damn money), he takes demotion, he makes the travel to see you, he even considers moving to your town though realizes it would put him at an even lower status career-wise ... while you sit back and haven't made any effort in changing your life around to accommodate him.
You said it's because you have kids ... kids are adaptable .. in fact, change is good for kids once in a while, so they can learn diversity.
This is a two-way road here .. partnerships are about compromising.
"If you love someone like I know he does, how do you just break it off like that?"
If you love someone, how can you not move with your kids to a location in which you two can be together? Somewhere along the line, it's only fair for you to make a sacrifice, also. And it's highly possible that this is a part of the reason why he broke it off with you. He is probably thinking that he's doing all the changing to accommodate you and your happiness.
I guess I'm just not seeing how he just broke it off, just like that without considering any other solution. What other solution would you have him consider?
Moving to your town and losing the rest of his status that he's worked so long and hard to secure? Don't you think that's a little unfair?
The solution I see in this is for you to move to his town. Change your job so it's no longer affiliated with his ... and I'd bet you he would be willing to work on the relationship again. Because he didn't tell you that he no longer is interested in you or doesn't love you ... he said that he just can't see how this is going to work out with what has happened to him with his job.
GJAnne .. he took all this with his work BECAUSE of you .. a man wouldn't do that unless he loved his woman.
"His world is being turned upside down..."
You have the ability to help turn his world rightside up by making a sacrifice for him and moving to his city ... why would you not want to do that?
If you love someone, how can you not move with your kids to a location in which you two can be together? Somewhere along the line, it's only fair for you to make a sacrifice, also. And it's highly possible that this is a part of the reason why he broke it off with you. He is probably thinking that he's doing all the changing to accommodate you and your happiness.
I guess I'm just not seeing how he just broke it off, just like that without considering any other solution. What other solution would you have him consider?
Moving to your town and losing the rest of his status that he's worked so long and hard to secure? Don't you think that's a little unfair?
The solution I see in this is for you to move to his town. Change your job so it's no longer affiliated with his ... and I'd bet you he would be willing to work on the relationship again. Because he didn't tell you that he no longer is interested in you or doesn't love you ... he said that he just can't see how this is going to work out with what has happened to him with his job.
GJAnne .. he took all this with his work BECAUSE of you .. a man wouldn't do that unless he loved his woman.
"His world is being turned upside down..."
You have the ability to help turn his world rightside up by making a sacrifice for him and moving to his city ... why would you not want to do that?
First, P-Angel, thank you for the amount of thought and time you've put into your post. It's helping me.
I completely see your point about my moving to his town and we have discussed it. We both agree that my town is a better environment than the city he is living in now. He could live there for 6 months or 3 years..we don't know yet. He's having to "do his time" at the Home Office and he would not like me to move my kids there and then find out in 6 months he can transfer to another position in a more desirable region and have to move them again. The other reason I can't move now is because of my ex-husband who is completely unreasonable and he will tie me up in court no doubt if I tried. I realize it sounds like I'm being unfair but it's something we both agree that I can't do for at least a couple years. I would absolutely move to him in a heartbeat if it was in the best interest of my kids and he 100% agrees with me on this one.
As of Jan 1, 08, my job and his do not have any affiliation whatsoever.
His career does mean the world to him and he takes a lot of pride in it. He is trying to get back to where he was status wise and I have no doubt that he will. Part of the reason I'm on DXP asking for help is that I won't call him right now...not while he's traveling and distract him from his job.
I'm with you on not seeing how he just broke it off like that, no warning. And I was the one on the other end of the phone. Total Shock. The other solution I would like him to consider is let's just wait and see how it goes for a while with the extra distance and less time apart...it's only been 6 weeks. Another position might come up sooner rather than later. I'm willing to wait it out but I feel like he's just giving up.
Thank you again
I completely see your point about my moving to his town and we have discussed it. We both agree that my town is a better environment than the city he is living in now. He could live there for 6 months or 3 years..we don't know yet. He's having to "do his time" at the Home Office and he would not like me to move my kids there and then find out in 6 months he can transfer to another position in a more desirable region and have to move them again. The other reason I can't move now is because of my ex-husband who is completely unreasonable and he will tie me up in court no doubt if I tried. I realize it sounds like I'm being unfair but it's something we both agree that I can't do for at least a couple years. I would absolutely move to him in a heartbeat if it was in the best interest of my kids and he 100% agrees with me on this one.
As of Jan 1, 08, my job and his do not have any affiliation whatsoever.
His career does mean the world to him and he takes a lot of pride in it. He is trying to get back to where he was status wise and I have no doubt that he will. Part of the reason I'm on DXP asking for help is that I won't call him right now...not while he's traveling and distract him from his job.
I'm with you on not seeing how he just broke it off like that, no warning. And I was the one on the other end of the phone. Total Shock. The other solution I would like him to consider is let's just wait and see how it goes for a while with the extra distance and less time apart...it's only been 6 weeks. Another position might come up sooner rather than later. I'm willing to wait it out but I feel like he's just giving up.
Thank you again
I doubt he's giving up, GJAnn .. he's just all freaked-out right now with all the turmoil going on in his life.
I didn't mean to make it sound like you weren't doing stuff for him, and as an afterthought, I realized that's how it sounded. I was just putting thoughts out there as they popped in my head, and I can only go off of what you posted. Sorry about that.
From what you've said about him, and his treatment of you, along with how you two have been making plans for the future .. I wouldn't give up hope on him. A Virgo doesn't take any job lightly .. and that would include his personal obligations and desires. If he has been considering you his woman for all this time and caring about your future and your children's ... then his feelings for you are for real.
But, right now .. he's got a lot of crap going on, and worry. You know, or maybe you don't know ... Virgo's LOVE to worry.
They just love it .... to fret, and fuss, and worry themselves sick about things .. it makes them feel like they are useful and providing you with all the concern so you don't have to. So, right now, he's probably sitting back, worrying himself to death about all this and relishing in the fact that he has this to worry about.
Crazy, I know .. but, that's how they work. Just like him telling you that it's the right thing to do because it isn't fair to .... he probably worried himself sick over this not being fair, and enjoyed every second of the fretting session.
Don't worry ... he's not going anywhere, GJAnn .. he just needs to take time to ...................................................worry some more When you talk to him this weekend, you'll see that he is still concerned about you and this whole ordeal.
Trust me ... I've been married to a Virgo for 25 years .. if he expresses any kind of concern over how you are doing, and asking about what's going on, and expressing any kind of worry about something between the two of you .. then he's still with you. Virgos have to make sure everything is right, everything is in order, everything is satisfactory and there are no WORRIES for you, lol
I didn't mean to make it sound like you weren't doing stuff for him, and as an afterthought, I realized that's how it sounded. I was just putting thoughts out there as they popped in my head, and I can only go off of what you posted. Sorry about that.
From what you've said about him, and his treatment of you, along with how you two have been making plans for the future .. I wouldn't give up hope on him. A Virgo doesn't take any job lightly .. and that would include his personal obligations and desires. If he has been considering you his woman for all this time and caring about your future and your children's ... then his feelings for you are for real.
But, right now .. he's got a lot of crap going on, and worry. You know, or maybe you don't know ... Virgo's LOVE to worry.
They just love it .... to fret, and fuss, and worry themselves sick about things .. it makes them feel like they are useful and providing you with all the concern so you don't have to. So, right now, he's probably sitting back, worrying himself to death about all this and relishing in the fact that he has this to worry about.Crazy, I know .. but, that's how they work. Just like him telling you that it's the right thing to do because it isn't fair to .... he probably worried himself sick over this not being fair, and enjoyed every second of the fretting session.
Don't worry ... he's not going anywhere, GJAnn .. he just needs to take time to ...................................................worry some more
When you talk to him this weekend, you'll see that he is still concerned about you and this whole ordeal.Trust me ... I've been married to a Virgo for 25 years .. if he expresses any kind of concern over how you are doing, and asking about what's going on, and expressing any kind of worry about something between the two of you .. then he's still with you. Virgos have to make sure everything is right, everything is in order, everything is satisfactory and there are no WORRIES for you, lol
P-Angel: "Trust me ... I've been married to a Virgo for 25 years .. if he expresses any kind of concern over how you are doing, and asking about what's going on, and expressing any kind of worry about something between the two of you .. then he's still with you. Virgos have to make sure everything is right, everything is in order, everything is satisfactory and there are no WORRIES for you, lol"
That should be the blurb on the homepage for the Virgo sign!
*gives round of applause
That should be the blurb on the homepage for the Virgo sign!
*gives round of applause
I sure am crossing my fingers your theory is right because I am about sick over it.
"I didn't mean to make it sound like you weren't doing stuff for him, and as an afterthought, I realized that's how it sounded. I was just putting thoughts out there as they popped in my head, and I can only go off of what you posted. Sorry about that."
No problem and no offense taken. You can only go by what I write and sometimes things written sound different than how they are.. Mainly because I suck at writing : )
Any thoughts from VirGuys? I'm a Gem and need to see every angle and hear all opinions please!
"I didn't mean to make it sound like you weren't doing stuff for him, and as an afterthought, I realized that's how it sounded. I was just putting thoughts out there as they popped in my head, and I can only go off of what you posted. Sorry about that."
No problem and no offense taken. You can only go by what I write and sometimes things written sound different than how they are.. Mainly because I suck at writing : )
Any thoughts from VirGuys? I'm a Gem and need to see every angle and hear all opinions please!
Oh, just saw you tollbooth after I posted. What do you think? If you feel like getting all into it?
Yes, he's still concerned for my kids and me... told me to make sure to let the kids know that the GirlScout cookies he got for them are still coming. Haven't told my kids about our ordeal though.
Yes, he's still concerned for my kids and me... told me to make sure to let the kids know that the GirlScout cookies he got for them are still coming. Haven't told my kids about our ordeal though.
GJA,
Middle-aged VirGuy here.
Just to clarify priorities: Family comes before Career. He has acted precisely as I would, and put you in the Family category, so he made Career sacrifices to support Family.
Lots of muddy water right now for him, so if you really want him, help him sort through the mess by being as "undemanding" and supportive as you can possibly be. Y'all have already invested a lot of time & effort into this thing, and Virgs don't like to give up...
BUT, if VirGuy doesn't see a way to the desired end state -- after TONS of thought! -- I doubt there is a way, and y'all may just have to accept that unfortunate outcome...
In the meanwhile, I wish you both good luck!!
~DyarStra?e
HUGE update!
Talked with Virgo last night and it's all very clear now. After going thru the normal catchup, I finally said something to the effect of ... it just doesn't add up to me. this does not make sense. So I asked him to be completely honest with and and wanted to know if there was someone else. He answered YES! I was trying to be very calm... He said it would have never happened had he had not been forced to move because while he still lived in "X" he still had hope. I knew he had a much younger girl (25ish) that used to work in his old office that he would talk to so my gut told me to ask if it was her..and he said yes. He said she reached out to him more than he did her and the rest is irrelevant.
He's a player and played me very well. What's worse about it is that I still have access to his Hilton Honors account (he apparently doesn't remember this) and looked on it and he is taking her to my hometown next weekend (when he was supposedly planning to see me at my house). It's on the beach....so he's gonna show her around my town so to speak. What's even more ironic is I had already made plans to go to the beach this weekend... except I would be coming home on Sunday and his reservations are for Sun and Mon night.
Closed chapter..not chapter, BOOK for me! Although he did call me today and I didn't answer and left me a voicemail to let me know that he's sending the GirlScouts cookies he bought for my kids and some pieces to a desk he brought me....How sweet he is!!
Anyway, notice any sarcasm? lol
Talked with Virgo last night and it's all very clear now. After going thru the normal catchup, I finally said something to the effect of ... it just doesn't add up to me. this does not make sense. So I asked him to be completely honest with and and wanted to know if there was someone else. He answered YES! I was trying to be very calm... He said it would have never happened had he had not been forced to move because while he still lived in "X" he still had hope. I knew he had a much younger girl (25ish) that used to work in his old office that he would talk to so my gut told me to ask if it was her..and he said yes. He said she reached out to him more than he did her and the rest is irrelevant.
He's a player and played me very well. What's worse about it is that I still have access to his Hilton Honors account (he apparently doesn't remember this) and looked on it and he is taking her to my hometown next weekend (when he was supposedly planning to see me at my house). It's on the beach....so he's gonna show her around my town so to speak. What's even more ironic is I had already made plans to go to the beach this weekend... except I would be coming home on Sunday and his reservations are for Sun and Mon night.
Closed chapter..not chapter, BOOK for me! Although he did call me today and I didn't answer and left me a voicemail to let me know that he's sending the GirlScouts cookies he bought for my kids and some pieces to a desk he brought me....How sweet he is!!
Anyway, notice any sarcasm? lol
Kick his sorry ass to the curb!!
But please, don't judge all Virgo men by the actions of this one. I know 6 VirGuys - counting myself - and 5 out of 6 are happily married, stable, and 100% loyal to our wives.
Your VG had serious issues -- mid-life crisis?? -- and I hate that it took so long to find out, but you are definitely better off for knowing how he really is...
"He's a player and played me very well."
Yeah, a VG can be a very effective player. We generally come across as honest & sincere, and a manipulative VG can use that to get inside a woman's head... and then inside her panties. Got one of those at work, and he's married, and I have nothing to do with him. He's got other issues, too, but I really can't bring myself to take an interest in his mental & emotional problems...
Take care of yourself! Forget about him!
Thanks Dy! I'm choosing to be an adult about this and just let it go. How dare someone do that to me and I didn't even see it coming..makes me feel naive.
But, there's the other side of me that would love to be completely vindictive and maybe use all his hilton honors points for a hotel for me the same nights ..somewhere else of course because he wouldn't be able to check the computer. Or go to a very naughty website and purchase some pretty shameful "toys" using his credit card and send them to his office while I know he won't be there and address it to him in care of his secretary.... or maybe.. well the list could be endless. Guess that's the other side of me (the evil twin) thinking.. someone else pointed out to me.
Anyway, I'll be over it soon. Just got to go have some fun!
But, there's the other side of me that would love to be completely vindictive and maybe use all his hilton honors points for a hotel for me the same nights ..somewhere else of course because he wouldn't be able to check the computer. Or go to a very naughty website and purchase some pretty shameful "toys" using his credit card and send them to his office while I know he won't be there and address it to him in care of his secretary.... or maybe.. well the list could be endless. Guess that's the other side of me (the evil twin) thinking.. someone else pointed out to me.
Anyway, I'll be over it soon. Just got to go have some fun!
This has me bitting my dayum nails!
Okay Perfect Gem, I'll update. Apparently the 20 something girl wasn't all that... Virgo called to tell me about it as if I'm going to have any sympathy for him. I listened to him, he said he thought he made a huge mistake and would like us continue on and even asked me if I would still go with him and his kids (daughter turning 21) to Cancun in August. The audacity!!!
I told him he's getting what he deserves (which does not include me) and I have absolutely no respect for him whatsoever. Guess he just thought he could pick up where he left off. He is definately standing corrected now. He also said he thought I would understand since I supposedly loved him. At that point, I just said you're unbelievable and hung up. He's since called 6 or so more times but I won't answer.
I think he realizes now how bad he screwed up and is really trying to let me know. Personally, I like knowing he's being tortured by his own conscience.
As I said before...closed book for me!
I told him he's getting what he deserves (which does not include me) and I have absolutely no respect for him whatsoever. Guess he just thought he could pick up where he left off. He is definately standing corrected now. He also said he thought I would understand since I supposedly loved him. At that point, I just said you're unbelievable and hung up. He's since called 6 or so more times but I won't answer.
I think he realizes now how bad he screwed up and is really trying to let me know. Personally, I like knowing he's being tortured by his own conscience.
As I said before...closed book for me!
Good Job GeminiJuneAnn!
I like it when Virgos learn lessons
!!!
I like it when Virgos learn lessons
!!!This GEM does not focus on guys who only shine outwardly! FYI
And the closed door, good for you, i am trying, i have tried for sometime w/out success, i guess i need to not listen.
IDK
again, time will tell
And the closed door, good for you, i am trying, i have tried for sometime w/out success, i guess i need to not listen.
IDK
again, time will tell
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