Another thread of being your own worst enemy .....

This topic was created in the Virgo forum by P-Angel on Tuesday, May 27, 2008 and has 46 replies.
This was written on a word processor and not edited for typos ? so, you all will have to figure out what I'm saying when words are missing or misspelled ?..
Like the "Trust" thread on Scorpio board, and many reality/awareness threads on the Pisces board .. this one is about Virgos and how they create the situation in which their heart breaks, or they are misunderstood due to their own treatment of others, and erroneously believe it's the other person hurting them or misunderstanding their intentions ? when in reality, the Virgo has created its own monster, unbeknownst to them because this is their blind spot.
This will be assessed by using quotes on dxp, and analyzing the psychology, which influences how other people respond to the Virgo. A person asked ??
?what does it mean when a virgo guy tells you how he's not used to showing emotions? While I was hanging out with a crush (who I think may have a crush on me too), he told me how his face will look passive in spite of the variety of emotions he may be feeling at the moment.?
An answer came from a male Virgo saying ??
?Absence of an emotional expression does not equal absence of emotions.? ? and a partial sentence saying, ? .. us Virgs are sensitive, observant, and emotional creatures -- but, we are VERY RESERVED, and others interpret that calm exterior as being flat & emotionless.?
If you are relating to a person who has feelings, perhaps deep feelings, and this person with feelings NEVER expresses them to you, instead they have a passive look on their face to suggest the absence of feelings ?.. then in reality, it's this person (Virgo) who is withholding how they feel about you in which has created the situation which leaves both parties confused and unsure about intentions.
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It's very common for a Virgo to say something like .. ?I can't trust a faker, a person has to be real, and honest? ?. But, how honest can a person be to a Virgo if the Virgo NEVER expresses how deeply they feel for the other person? Doesn't this create a situation in which the other person has no option except to be dramatic with intentions of pulling a feeling out of the Virgo, any feeling, even if it's anger?
People ARE emotional, that is the nature of the beast ?.. and being emotional creatures, we MUST have some kind of emotional nurturing in order to feel loved by the other person ? and if a Virgo is NOT expressing these emotions (by choice, apparently) ? then if their heart gets broken by the other person leaving them high and dry .. isn't this in fact, their own fault?
So, now we have this condition comprehended .. the Virgo will shrug off emotional intimacy, as Branh has said often in here. Doesn't it then seem logical that the Virgo will have no other recourse except to become dependent upon and cling to whomever is willing to express emotions for them?
Here's another quote pulled from dxp ?..
?He didn't marry the partner due to the ex scorp. He said that a virgo never gives up hope, which I understood that he had always hope for the ex scorp to return. I told him that he probably hurt his ex scorp to a point of no return. When it's over for us, it will be over.?
What does this mean? The Virgo didn't re-marry in his life because he refuses to give up hope that his ex-Scorp would return to him, eventhough he likely hurt her to the point of no return. Doesn't this describe this ?dependency? of emotional expression placed on another person for him to live, and will even allow it to direct his future relationships .. to the point of it being reason for not marrying again?
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If you love somebody so much that marriage is a thought .. then how burdened are you with emotional baggage that this will be the cause for you to inflict on a different person as to the reason WHY you can't commit to them? It seems apparent why a Virgo cannot let go of a person who will express for them, and so will place upon this person a hope and a prayer that they will return to you, so you can live through the other person who is expressing emotions.
Virgo's are stuck ? they've stuck themselves ?. by NOT expressing how they feel, eventhough they are experiencing these feelings and expecting another person to live it for them so they have an avenue in which to vicariously live.
?I tend to keep a neutral face too when dealing with people, but it's more of a defense mechanism more than anything else.?
The above was a Virgo quote as for the reason for not expressing how she feels, and calling it a defense mechanism ? but, isn't it actually the open-doorway to be hurt? If by having this stone face, when emotions are actually felt .. then in reality it isn't protecting a Virgo from getting hurt .. it is CAUSING the Virgo to get hurt because then the person they are relating to will betray them by NOT trusting that the Virgo ?feels? them. It's a perpetuation, NOT a defense.
But, V's cannot see it, just like Scorpios can't see that it's them who doesn't trust, just like it's Gemini's who are jealous of other people .. not the other way around.
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It's countless how many times I've read in here where a Virgo says they are so misunderstood. Here's a quote from Virgo, asking a question as to why she is so misunderstood ?
?Virgos are misunderstood...Virgos have the best hearts, we are accepting of everyone and we are loyal to our friends and to those we love. We never ask for help and yet we are willing to help everyone! It seems our nature is completely out of sync with the rest of the world. Virgos are too sensitive to stomach the harsh realities of this world. We just want everyone to be happy and want to love and be loved. When we treat people with kindness, we are misinterpreted as "stupid." When we stand our ground and demand respect, we are "harassing." We feel everything deeply. That is why we can be extremely emotional. Nothing is frivolous to us. We don't find pleasure in the suffering of others. We are courageous, loving people!
So I ask, what can I, as a virgo, do to protect my loving heart??

Virgo's, Virgo's, Virgo's ??????. People ARE emotional beings, we KNOW you love us or care for us by expressing emotions to us .. we CANNOT read your heart. If you withhold expressing how you feel, and you claim to feel deeply, then you leave yourself no other option except to feel misunderstood.
How many times has a Virgo come in here and said something like, ?I'm not a mind-reader, so speak up. Tell me?? Yet, you withhold this from us, you will NOT tell us how you feel ? and then wallow in feeling so misunderstood.
Can you not see how this is illogical, and that you are your own worst enemy?
If you do NOT show us through emotional expression that you feel us ? then we will know not where your heart is coming from.
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Here's a quote from the Pisces board, where a Virgo woman is pining away because a P-man has swam away from her, and she doesn't know where to turn ?
?but I can only do so much if he's not talking to me. I even asked him yesterday why he's turn to hate me so much and I got nothing., and truly, after the engagement comment, I'm so hurt. It makes me feel like I wasn't worth anything, I don't want to be angry with him even though I think I have evey reason to but bottom line is I love him, never told told him but from the first day I met him.?
Look at the last sentence, coupled with the first sentence ??. She now wants him to communicate to her how he's feelings ? and she NEVER told him how she felt about him.
?bottom line is I love him, never told told him but from the first day I met him?
She is in shambles because this man won't reciprocate loving feelings that she NEVER told him.
Virgo's, Virgo', Virgo's ????. We ARE emotional beings ? we will NOT feel loved if you do NOT express it to us ? we cannot read your minds, or your hearts.
Can you NOT see how this woman above has caused this P-man to misunderstand her heart by NOT telling him how she feels about him? Now, she's left to feel helpless because he won't talk to her. Of course he won't talk to her ?. for 10 months these two have trying to have a relationship and for 10 months she loved him and NEVER told him. Why should he talk to her now?
For 10 months, her silence in NOT expressing her emotions left the Fish cold.
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Here's one from the Scorpio board ? the ?he? in which this refers is a Virgo ?..
?At the end of the day, we both had a huge fight, and he said to me that he never wanted to have anything to do with me ever again. We met up once since, and he told me it was ok for me to keep in touch once in a while, so I have been.?
Here we have a Virgo throwing in the towel after a fight, and refuses to continue nurturing or supporting the relationship ?.. yet, expects the woman (non-V) to continue contacting him to put forth all the effort in communicating to him how she feels. Further in this situation above, the woman said that he hasn't contacting her since ?. Yet, receives her contact she makes to him. She has even sent light messages to him to change the tone, and still he doesn't respond ?.. yet, if they meet up, he wants her to keep contact with him to keep expressing how she feels about him.
Eventually, her heart will turn cold for him, same as everybody elses who relates to a Virgo because they DO NOT RETURN how they feel ?. While maintaining they actually feel deeply, and merely choose not to express it.
How many times have we heard in here where Virgo's say something like ?. ?Why does everybody hate on us? ??? hate .. you'll embrace to comment on ? love ?.. utter silence.
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Again, this thread is only about how Virgo's create this condition to be reflected back on them, and nobody wants to hate you, or anybody else ? what we want is expression of feelings, loving feelings.
Expression of them ?.. that's all.
If you cannot express them, or feel like you have to protect yourself from loving feelings ?. Then in essence, this means you don't really WANT to embrace them. If a person has to protect themselves from an intruder, then it means the don't want the intruder. If a person has to protect themselves from being taken advantage of, then it means they don't want to be taken advantage of. If a person has to protect themselves from physical abuse, then it means they don't want to be physical abused.
If a Virgo has to protect themselves from expressing emotions .. then it means they don't want to feel anyone. If a Virgo has to protect themselves from showing another person how they feel ? then it means they don't want anyone to feel them back.
If you don't want to express emotions, Virgos ? then you cause your own pain being inflicted upon you, for other people will indeed misunderstand your heart and believe you to be cold-hearted.

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change
The courage to change the things I can
And the wisdom to know the difference

Virgo's ??? we ARE emotional beings, this you cannot change. If you want to be loved by something with all their heart ?. Then you HAVE to express this emotion to them ?
HAVE TO ?? otherwise, you will be defeated and left to clinging onto to hope that doesn't exist = perpetual hopelessness.
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Nice post!
good details.
Virgos - GROW UP!
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Caprigirl .. this below portion of a quote above by a Virgo, really stands out to me ...
"We feel everything deeply. That is why we can be extremely emotional. Nothing is frivolous to us. We don't find pleasure in the suffering of others. We are courageous, loving people!"
Nothing is frivolous .. except withholding feelings, which in turn, makes the person they are relating to feel like the Virgo thinks them as frivolous.
think about that ..... if a person didn't express how they felt about you, then wouldn't you think that they considered you to be expendable?
Websters - frivolous: of little weight or importance, lacking in seriousness, marked by unbecoming levity

A Virgo may say, and actually believe ..

"We don't find pleasure in the suffering of others"

But, isn't that exactly what they do? Perhaps, there is no pleasure in it .. however, if there is an indifference to it and calling it a defense against being hurt themselves .. then they are indeed not feeling guilty about inflicting this kind of emotional torment onto another person .. so long as they themselves are taken seriously.
There isn't anybody on this planet who would feel important or special if their partner didn't emotionally express to them how important they are .. in fact, they would feel the opposite, they would feel like the Virgo wasn't taking this love seriously .. they would feel frivolous.

And again .. this is just addressing a Blindness within Virgos, and we all have one.

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PA:
Is every thing OK between you and your Mr.V?
If not, bring him on the board, we will "teach him a lesson or
two" Winking.
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PA:
Is every thing OK between you and your Mr.V?

Everything is great, actually, Caprigirl .... how about you and your V-man? I'm unclear why just because I point out subconcious behavioural traits of Virgo why it would lead you to think something was not ok.
These type of threads get posted on other boards, too, addressing other signs Blind Spots.
Capricorn has a blind spot, too .. perhaps, I'll post it for you guys smile
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Caprigirl ... my husband used to read most of what I post in here, but, he sort of lost interest once Scorpius left.
We miss him terribly Sad
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Yes, I believe so ... it's because the Virgo is reflective.
Because they are service-providers, and this is how they show concern and care for another .. they can only accomplish this by observing the needs, wants and desires of the other person .. then they proceed to project onto this other person whatever it is they assessed as being needing, so they can perform a duty within the other persons life for them.
However, the down-side to this is .... when a Virgo does this (naturally), they aren't really expressing their OWN desires, or needs, or wants .. they are essentially, forsaking their own and providing exclusively according to the other.
In so doing, they have become programmed subconciously to forgo their own emotional expression as it pertains to the other ... because if they projected their own then it would negate, and perhaps burden, providing this service to the other person.
It's hard to explain .. you'd have to be a Virgo to "get" it ...
Example: My Virgo husband would miss a portion of his very dear football game on the television, to run out to the gas station to fill my tank up, check my tires, fill the washer fluid, check all other fluids ... if I was making a road trip. He wouldn't WANT to do this for himself .. for himself, he would want to be planted in his chair with beer in hand .. however, he would NEVER, NEVER, EVER voice this disgruntlement, or make any kind of physical emotional reaction to having to miss a portion of his game ......... in his mind, his job is to make my life easier, to provide, and if my feelings were expressing that I hate to gas-up, or don't know how to check tires (which I do), or any kind of feelings to suggest that I don't want to do this ... then he will pick up on this reflection I'm sending out to him and he'll do it ... gladly .. forsaking himself, and his own desires.
So, because this is how they show care and concern, and to a Virgo, this is their love ... then they would deem it selfish to concern themselves with their own feelings of what they want, or how they feel.
This appears to be a quality in which they are born with ... and so have been conditioned by their sun to withhold emotional expression, so they can mirror back to other people what it is the other needs.
However, the flaw in this is .... the only thing others really NEED is for their Virgo to express emotionally so that we can also feel valuable in providing = the unselfishness has become selfish.
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"t's very common for a Virgo to say something like .. ?I can't trust a faker, a person has to be real, and honest? ?. But, how honest can a person be to a Virgo if the Virgo NEVER expresses how deeply they feel for the other person?"
I agree with this, thid may be why a lot of Virgos (that I now) tend to date people who express their emotions more freely
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know*
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What causes a Virgo male to stop "servicing" ... providing service for someone ?
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p angel-
i only read your first 2 posts....
I am with a virgo and have many virgo friends, both male and female.
Virgos FEEL!! They just don't want the entire freakin mankind to know it. They are looking for a deeper love that can sense their feelings without them HAVING to so blantantly show it.
They have a lot of reserve and self respect, and are EXTREMELY private people.
This is a form of self preservation and protection.
Geez, scorpios do it..why can't virgo?
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oh yah..i am aries...i also EXPRESS pretty openly... really no guessing games here.
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This thread never said that Virgos don't feel .. quite the opposite.
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so it seems like P is saying that virgo's express their feelings through action rather than words or the other mushy gushy stuff...i think...
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We can all agree that...
1. Virgos are reserved.
2. Virgos are cautious.
3. Virgos are sensitive.
4. Virgos are observant.
I know of myself and my peers that we are also tender-hearted, and that part of the calm / flat public persona is to protect our vulnerable selves. I also know from the writings of astrologers and from my own experiences that Virgos are fully aware of how we can be our own worst enemies in the "public relations" games that others play. And, quite frankly, we don't care! We are REAL, we are HONEST, and we believe that TRUTH prevails. Cynical Virgos are those who've lost hope in that core belief, and turn back on the world all the bullshit we're asked to consume by the disingenuous all around us.
Again: This middle-aged Virgo male is very happily married to a sensitive Scorpio woman. The vast majority of Virgo men I know personally are happily married. I feel quite certain that their wives could support my statements, but I won't risk my precious anonymity on this forum to refute yet another "ain't it awful!" P-Angel thread...
~DyarStra?e
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To me, it basically only comes down to who makes the first move. I am extremely emotional, but am cautious of who to show it to.
As soon as the person I am interested in opens up to me, I open up to them.
I reciprocate the emotion I feel back from the other person, that's all.
If you feel that your virgo is showing you emotions in the wrong ways, just tell him. That's all. I'm sure he'll do whatever it takes to show you what you would like to see.
If i am being "emotionless" to another person, I have no clue, and if told I am will most likely apologize and spill my guts uncontrollably.
It is a "defense mechanism" at times, not showing too many emotions to not scare someone off, but many times we just are unsure of what the other person wants. We don't want to come off as too strong. But we also don't want to come off as too weak either. So just tell us if you feel we're not showing you what you want/need.
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Last night I was reading Starsky and Cox's chapter on Virgo man and Virgo woman, Virgo man chapter man dense as hell crazy, Virgo woman the wildest chapter in the book, Virgo girls are Wild!
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Goodness, P-Angel,
You tell the truth smile
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I suppose its not a matter of being dependt and clinging as much as Virgo's perfectionistic streak constantly trying to mold their partners into perfect images of uhhhh I don't know what, but going back to my book if Scorpio is the "Stranger" Virgo is the "Outsider".
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"stomach the harshness" that is cos if they are typical types they have strong perfectionistic sensibilities but Virgo is a Mutable sign of communication so they will normally express what or how they feel but the impression that I got especially male Virgos they try to modify the characteristics of their partners/ but Virgo girls wow! lots of pent up energy waiting to be released.
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And besides Virgos are not "reserved" ever been around Virgo Yakkers? But yes Virgos are discerning and observant but I think this can go overboard like that Bill O' Riley guy? y'know yeah? yeh > Give him about lets say 20 different issues about society and so he comes into his studio at 9 in the morning an he will be Virgo Yakking from 9am to 9pm I wouldn't be surprized.
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Virgos are nowhere nearly as reserved as the typical Taurus types can be.
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I am sure that when typical Virgos sense that they are being discourteous they will most likely change their behavior.
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Starsky and Cox on Virgo Man
"Virgo may suffer from many irrational fears, such as disease phobia. He can be distrustful and critical of others. Feelings of dissapointment may fuel pathological lying., especially surronding his origins. Innate self-loathing may lead to psychosomatic illness and/or an obsession with his physical being. Virgo tends to tamper with his looks, falling prey to eating disorders or even a compulsion for plastic surgery."
Shows just how extreme Virgo can be and many loose it I wouldn't be surprized if there are many schizoid Virgo men on the streets. Aquarius also has schizophrenic tendencies but ofcourse a separate platitude, Pisces and Sagittarius. Geminis are steel mental traps can be drifters but I don't think they totally loose it that much other than being estranged from their native homes. But about Virgo it goes back to a Virgo projection on their partners although I suppose that Virgo women are less extreme. Considering 'disease phobi' such as the Virgo types that have a constant compulsion to wash their hands > this definitely needs a psychological adjustment shows you the flip side, the rationality of this sign but with quirks.
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Starsky and Cox > Straight Virgo Man turn - ons
older/experienced females
Asian women
small breasts
skinny legs
waifs, wastrels
submission
girl-on-top
white shoes, stockings
handcuffs, harnesses
streetwalkers
(passive) discipline
(passive) s + m
nurses, secretaries
technicians
playing doctor
fingering
voyerism/other couples
heavy porn
lite pain
humilation/ being cuckolded
(passive) teasing/torture
alcohol, downers
piercing, branding
gags, hoods, masks
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Joe,
Can you please post for capricrons?
Why is it always for virgos?
Please post the sametype of analysis for capricorns - mainly for women.
What do Starsky and Cox say about caps?
Thanks - I am tired of reading about virgos!
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Joe Stickler ... How about Virgo Males turn offs ... does it have them ???
And how about Aries Girls ... what does it say about us ???
Thanks !!!
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Hey Caps ... good to see you ... yeah ... tell us about us girls ... please !!!
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How about Virgo Males turn offs
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Aren't the themselves a turn-off Winking??
Just kidding!!
Yes-we would like to hear about all BUT virgos!

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Joe...
Where are you!? I can't wait to read about cap women!
It must be nice Winking... Not like boring virgo stuff!
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Ok one sec CappyG and there is none on that Virgin bu wait for the Cauldron of the Earth Virgo girlies
Starsky and Cox Straigh Turn - Ons
high power creatives
rockers, painters
(passive) b + d (wot! does this meanz?)
facial hair
hygine
circumcision
business suits, bosses
(active) oral
bikers, skinheads
(passive) anal
doggy style
ribbed condoms
tantric techniques
toys, vibrators
candle wax
tatoos, piercings
toys, vibrators
maid/secretary role-play
degradation, humiliation
doctor/nurse fantasies
(passive) lite s + m
navels (I got a noice! one)
corsets, garters
crotchless underwear
high leather boots
dungeons, goths
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Hey Cap ... how my pair of boots do you own ?
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This book does both straight and gay > its a mind, body, sexes, behavior and soul book about the zodiac signs, both woman and man. www.amazon.com its more lucid than uhhhh Linda Goodman but I like both but this one is updated
Starsky and Cox > Straight Capricorn Woman Turn - Ons
younger men
dark, curly, wavy hair (me got it!)
lanky physiques
collegiates, intellectuals
tweed, flannel suits
big noses, cleft chins
spectacles
men in uniform
laborers, contractors (omg lol)
strangers, travellers
executives
(passive) worship
masturbating during intercourse
stripping, teasing
exhibitionism
domination
teacher/student fantasies
hands and feet
high heels, hose, garters
lingerie
(active) seduction
delivery men
missionary
doggy style
(passive) oral
tantrism, sprituality
stoicism (this is no doubt a Capricorn trait!)
hygiene, soapy smells
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Uh ... don't forget Aries girls please Joe Stickler ...
Hey Cap ... if you check my profile ... you will remember me from my first ID ...
I think you worte me a very nice letter about my Virgo prob ... remember me ?!
Virgo Guy all gone ... for me anyway !!!
He would like to be my friend !!! ... ??? ... I am not inclined to do that ... he's been such a wanker ...
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hello ... wrote ... sorry for the mis-spell ... I need to utilize spell check ... LOL
WROTE
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Joe,
Thanks for posting. I attest to the cap woman's stuff you posted. Most of it, but not all is true.
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Virgingirl,
I can't recall your old id. But whoever you are, welcome back.
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Caps ... I changed my ID because my old Virgo boyfriend cruises and reads this board ... I am trying to break it off clean since it's his idea to stop the romance and just stay platonic friends ...he still wants to be friends and hasn't given up that angle yet ...
You gave me good advice about a month ago ... Thanks !!!
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(active) seduction--- DEFINITELY this one!
I enjoy it so much when he tries so hard to please me in his subtle, sweet ways.. BUT I decode all of his subtle stuff...
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You gave me good advice about a month ago ... Thanks !!!
******
Oh Ok.. In that case, keep your ID changed.
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