Office Gossip and an angry Virgo - yikes!!!
This topic was created in the Virgo forum by Chatz on Thursday, March 12, 2009 and has 140 replies.
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well pushing you away is a strong sign that there is some truth to this rumor, how much of it is truth is something you will have to gather on your own if he's not forthcoming with an explanation.
thank you for sharing.
If he's really upset about it, he may just be in his head and you have to "wait" for him to come out of the cave and be ready to discuss it.
Speaking first hand, if something has REALLY has set me off, a lot of times I just want to be left alone until I'm ready share it. If my gal at the time tries to "Force" me to come out of my cave before I'm ready, it only puts me deeper in.
(Yes, image of hibernating bear in a cave is TOTALLY applicable lol)
If she lets me know she's got my back and there for me when I'm ready, then she's the first person I go to when its time to leave the cave.
Not so sure about the time being spent though...
Speaking first hand, if something has REALLY has set me off, a lot of times I just want to be left alone until I'm ready share it. If my gal at the time tries to "Force" me to come out of my cave before I'm ready, it only puts me deeper in.
(Yes, image of hibernating bear in a cave is TOTALLY applicable lol)
If she lets me know she's got my back and there for me when I'm ready, then she's the first person I go to when its time to leave the cave.
Not so sure about the time being spent though...
Im figuring that but he hasnt once tried to make sure that I dont actually think there is something going on. Him being her hero by being angry that her reputation has been tarnished is all well and good but he has left me hanging thinking the worst now even though I know he'd not go there with her....
Blah, guess he'll come out when he's ready.....its a really awkward position to be in for all concerned but when somebody avoids communication about it, it makes it even worse. He hasnt handled this well at all
Blah, guess he'll come out when he's ready.....its a really awkward position to be in for all concerned but when somebody avoids communication about it, it makes it even worse. He hasnt handled this well at all
top chef made a valid point BUT your guy chose to IGNORE YOU AND CONSOLE SOMEONE ELSE, to me that's a red flag that there is a hint of truth to the story and how would anyone know what he's doing with this woman unless this woman is feeding the frenzy and yet making herself seem like the victim, it seems that this woman is manipulative and most likely the cause of the injury and accusations that's going around in the office...
Yep....Im leaving him to it. He has chosen not to talk to me now in fear "he might say something he'll regret later"...WTF??
I get he's angry but he hasnt spent 10 minutes to console me yet he works in the same office as her and Im sure they've had their chats and consoling, yada yada.
I have received the message loud and clear...over and out
I get he's angry but he hasnt spent 10 minutes to console me yet he works in the same office as her and Im sure they've had their chats and consoling, yada yada.
I have received the message loud and clear...over and out
Oh there is NOTHING going on with them...it is nothing but office gossip and he is more the fatherly figure as she is half his age for Godsake and it also refers to 2 other men in the office...its trash and its horrible and I understand its infuriating but for 3 days I have been treated like a lepper.
He did today apologise for shutting me out, that he just didnt want to say something he'd regret later but he doesnt realise that by shutting me out he may very well watch my back...he did say in his email (he couldnt even ring me) "please forgive me"....WTF? He also wrote "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?" WTF? I still have to wait for the weekend? get over it I say.
I just wrote back to his email explaining the above and said "doesnt matter, have a good weekend"....you see he has blown me off each and everytime this week that I have asked to talk about what has happened so Im sure that he will understand my blow off. Im sure it wont even register with him and he'll think ok she's just fine, she doesnt need to talk...no dramas....yes the Virgo cave it is.
All was going so brilliantly before this gossip came around but if he treats something like this so badly and treats me with contempt how the hell would he be if something more dramatic were to occur with us or our lives in some way? My God, he'd run away for weeks.
I know he'll contact me over the weekend and probably buy truffles yet again LOL...but you know I would rather he not and just have had 10 minutes of his time for us to ensure "we're" ok and that we'll stick together through this tough time at work. He was too busy, too angry to chat with me, too busy, too angry to bother saving our relationship from going through this.
I really dont know what to do - got the apology via email...he couldnt even ask me to meet him for a coffee to talk...it had to be via email. This time last week I was on cloud 9 with him...in the space of a few days and a few nasty people talking about shit they dont know about I feel like Ive lost my best friend and this is all over.
Am I being too harsh in not MELTING just coz he said "Im sorry, please forgive me" after 3 days? He's made no effort at all since that...WTF? If I meant something wouldnt you all think he'd fight to see me now knowing how he's behaved has affected me? Or is that just the female in me talking and he really just doesnt have a clue?
He did today apologise for shutting me out, that he just didnt want to say something he'd regret later but he doesnt realise that by shutting me out he may very well watch my back...he did say in his email (he couldnt even ring me) "please forgive me"....WTF? He also wrote "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?" WTF? I still have to wait for the weekend? get over it I say.
I just wrote back to his email explaining the above and said "doesnt matter, have a good weekend"....you see he has blown me off each and everytime this week that I have asked to talk about what has happened so Im sure that he will understand my blow off. Im sure it wont even register with him and he'll think ok she's just fine, she doesnt need to talk...no dramas....yes the Virgo cave it is.
All was going so brilliantly before this gossip came around but if he treats something like this so badly and treats me with contempt how the hell would he be if something more dramatic were to occur with us or our lives in some way? My God, he'd run away for weeks.
I know he'll contact me over the weekend and probably buy truffles yet again LOL...but you know I would rather he not and just have had 10 minutes of his time for us to ensure "we're" ok and that we'll stick together through this tough time at work. He was too busy, too angry to chat with me, too busy, too angry to bother saving our relationship from going through this.
I really dont know what to do - got the apology via email...he couldnt even ask me to meet him for a coffee to talk...it had to be via email. This time last week I was on cloud 9 with him...in the space of a few days and a few nasty people talking about shit they dont know about I feel like Ive lost my best friend and this is all over.
Am I being too harsh in not MELTING just coz he said "Im sorry, please forgive me" after 3 days? He's made no effort at all since that...WTF? If I meant something wouldnt you all think he'd fight to see me now knowing how he's behaved has affected me? Or is that just the female in me talking and he really just doesnt have a clue?
Guess Im just wondering if its a sincere apology (given he hasnt made any more effort than an email) or whether he's just pretending to care now...thats how it feels anyway.
Yes he didnt say anything he'd regret but does he realise that by pushing me away he may just very well regret he didnt say anything? Id rather he showed me the anger, to lean on me to get things off his chest but nup, nothing.
Please dont think Im naive and say "how do you know nothing is going on with them" because thats just ridiculous and I work with these people and he spends most of his working day chatting to me and we spend nights and weekends together and yes men can fit other women in, I am NOT that naive so please do me a favour and dont say there is a chance coz there's always a chance something is going on. I trust him explicitly with that but the way he's behaved towards me? disgraceful and I feel more hurt by that than the gossip itself -
Stupid stupid stupid
Yes he didnt say anything he'd regret but does he realise that by pushing me away he may just very well regret he didnt say anything? Id rather he showed me the anger, to lean on me to get things off his chest but nup, nothing.
Please dont think Im naive and say "how do you know nothing is going on with them" because thats just ridiculous and I work with these people and he spends most of his working day chatting to me and we spend nights and weekends together and yes men can fit other women in, I am NOT that naive so please do me a favour and dont say there is a chance coz there's always a chance something is going on. I trust him explicitly with that but the way he's behaved towards me? disgraceful and I feel more hurt by that than the gossip itself -
Stupid stupid stupid
yes I understand that but you'd think he could have given me 10 minutes over the past 3 days. I have also been implicated in this gossip as now Im also giving them all "favours" because I go to lunch with Virgo and sometimes I go along with the team he works with to lunch plus we work closely together at times on different projects. There are obviously some very bored people at my work...didnt realise how much.
I did let Virgo know about my part but he all he came back with is "im sorry that I have been too angry and have shut you out"....thats it? Oh sorry, he did say "forgive me".....oh and then another email "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?"...then he left for the day??
He's obviously shaken and the female in question doesnt seem all that upset to be honest but he has adequately protected her reputation in his own little way but he did not even make 10 minutes for me today after learning that I too have been the latest in this wicked web. WTF?
Doesnt matter - guess its better to vent on here. Im not expecting anybody to know what he's thinking, etc.....I gather he is doing the cave thing and he'll work it out eventually and none of you know all the story but we dont have all day and these posts cut out after a while LOL.
He'll no doubt come back when he's good and ready and have a swag full of excuses as to why I was the last on his list of importance. Ahhh yes thats right I am actually sleeping with him....Its true that Im doing those things with him....so I guess it doesnt matter.
I did let Virgo know about my part but he all he came back with is "im sorry that I have been too angry and have shut you out"....thats it? Oh sorry, he did say "forgive me".....oh and then another email "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?"...then he left for the day??
He's obviously shaken and the female in question doesnt seem all that upset to be honest but he has adequately protected her reputation in his own little way but he did not even make 10 minutes for me today after learning that I too have been the latest in this wicked web. WTF?
Doesnt matter - guess its better to vent on here. Im not expecting anybody to know what he's thinking, etc.....I gather he is doing the cave thing and he'll work it out eventually and none of you know all the story but we dont have all day and these posts cut out after a while LOL.
He'll no doubt come back when he's good and ready and have a swag full of excuses as to why I was the last on his list of importance. Ahhh yes thats right I am actually sleeping with him....Its true that Im doing those things with him....so I guess it doesnt matter.
Paranoia is a self-destroyer.
You know nothing .. but, think you know something.
And that ^^^^^^ is going to destroy you ....... not anything he's done, or this girl who needs a ride home from work ...
Can we say jealous?
You know nothing ..... and more you present yourself to him as though you have suspicion that you know something, the further you actually push him away .... but, seeing that this paranoia is destroying any common sense you might own at the moment, you will be unable to see that the only enemy you have in this scenerio is yourself.
For example, you would say such things as ....
"he has spent even more time with her trying to make HER feel better about it all....WTF?"
... you don't KNOW that ^^^^, yet, I'm sure you are presenting yourself to him as such, making him feel guilty, or have to answer to you about this, eventhough you have no knowledge at all that this is happening .... it's speculatin on your part because you are paranoid and jealous.
If you aren't a fly on the wall .. then you really have to knowledge whatsoever in knowing that he is nurturing her emotionally ... yet, you will allow yourself to loose sight of yourself and present yourself in such as a way as to believe make-believe you have in your mind because you are paranoid, and jealous.
" .. rumours hurt ME? "
Rumors hurt you? You've said several times that you (((( know )))) the rumors are false, so if you have this (((know))) then you ARE actually saying the rumors of false implications are hurting you.
Rumors? For real, this is about rumors?
Are you in high school?
"Does he not see what he is risking losing in this process .."
Seriously .... if you don't get a grip on yourself, you are the one at risk of losing him, not the other way around.
YOu want your Virgo talk to you about this?
Then calmed yourself down, and stop acting like a jealous person who already has it in her mind that foul play is at hand .....
If you cannot trust him, then why in the hell exactly should he trust you enough to talk to you about ................. anything?
You know nothing .. but, think you know something.
And that ^^^^^^ is going to destroy you ....... not anything he's done, or this girl who needs a ride home from work ...
Can we say jealous?
You know nothing ..... and more you present yourself to him as though you have suspicion that you know something, the further you actually push him away .... but, seeing that this paranoia is destroying any common sense you might own at the moment, you will be unable to see that the only enemy you have in this scenerio is yourself.
For example, you would say such things as ....
"he has spent even more time with her trying to make HER feel better about it all....WTF?"
... you don't KNOW that ^^^^, yet, I'm sure you are presenting yourself to him as such, making him feel guilty, or have to answer to you about this, eventhough you have no knowledge at all that this is happening .... it's speculatin on your part because you are paranoid and jealous.
If you aren't a fly on the wall .. then you really have to knowledge whatsoever in knowing that he is nurturing her emotionally ... yet, you will allow yourself to loose sight of yourself and present yourself in such as a way as to believe make-believe you have in your mind because you are paranoid, and jealous.
" .. rumours hurt ME? "
Rumors hurt you? You've said several times that you (((( know )))) the rumors are false, so if you have this (((know))) then you ARE actually saying the rumors of false implications are hurting you.
Rumors? For real, this is about rumors?
Are you in high school?
"Does he not see what he is risking losing in this process .."
Seriously .... if you don't get a grip on yourself, you are the one at risk of losing him, not the other way around.
YOu want your Virgo talk to you about this?
Then calmed yourself down, and stop acting like a jealous person who already has it in her mind that foul play is at hand .....
If you cannot trust him, then why in the hell exactly should he trust you enough to talk to you about ................. anything?
Your drama is going to send him packing .. mark my words.
You're just like my x-leo lol.
Chatz, is your response / how you're feeling based on something he's said to you or something he wrote to you in an email. If its from an email... I'm not sure you're going to get or hear what you want out of written text from him.
Do you trust him or not? Not regarding the office chic but that he cares about you?
If so, then believe in that.
Chatz, is your response / how you're feeling based on something he's said to you or something he wrote to you in an email. If its from an email... I'm not sure you're going to get or hear what you want out of written text from him.
Do you trust him or not? Not regarding the office chic but that he cares about you?
If so, then believe in that.
"I get he's angry but he hasnt spent 10 minutes to console me yet he works in the same office as her and Im sure they've had their chats and consoling, yada yada.
I have received the message loud and clear...over and out"
You have no clue as to what their communication/relations consists of on the emotional level .. the only thing you've recieved loud and clear, and apparantly are acting off of, is your own jealousy because unless you are a fly on the wall .. you are clueless as to the extent of their relationship ... yet, you are acting off of a "know" that you don't have and presenting it as fact.
Fool
I have received the message loud and clear...over and out"
You have no clue as to what their communication/relations consists of on the emotional level .. the only thing you've recieved loud and clear, and apparantly are acting off of, is your own jealousy because unless you are a fly on the wall .. you are clueless as to the extent of their relationship ... yet, you are acting off of a "know" that you don't have and presenting it as fact.
Fool
Ummm Im not the fool as I saw for myself that he took her in his car alone the very afternoon for a lunch break when he told me in his words "Im about to go to lunch with the gang"....there they were walking to the car alone, he took off with her alone, they came back and hour and a half alone. He has gone to lunch with her the entire week (just that day alone though)....so you see I am NOT the fool. They work together in the same office, have morning tea, afternoon tea, he drives her to and from work 3 out of 5 days and they can do all the talking they like, yet he did not once try to have a discussion with me about this.
I have shown him NO jealousy and that is why I came here...he does NOT know the extent of how I feel right now.
He has SHOWN me that he is capable fo shutting me out as he deliberately, after 8 months didnt chat to me for those 3 days then yesterday afternoon when he found out that it wasnt only her honour at stake it was mine also he bothered to ask "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?"
At the end of the day no matter what you all say, its not jealousy as Ive already said I know nothing has been going on but he has hurt me more than any gossip or rumours could have by excluding me entirely for the past 3 days. I came to him at least 3 times during the last 2 days asking to please talk and have a coffee. He returned my request with "I dont think now is a good time to talk, I might say something I'll regret later"...WTF? why would he say something to me that he'll regret when I did not start nor get involved in any of these rumours. He told me he was also too busy (suddenly after 8 months?). I did not once mention anything about thinking there was truth to the rumours.
Its nice that the other woman has such a loyal friend looking out for her welfare. I hope she realises how lucky she is.
I am hurt, I am angry and Im sorry but if you're in a relationship the normal thing to do is to be able to communicate and ensure your partner feels safe and happy. He hasnt done any of that and all I wanted was 10 minutes of his time but he was too busy, too busy by taking her out for lunch, too busy coming in late and leaving early.
Whatever, dont worry about it.
I have shown him NO jealousy and that is why I came here...he does NOT know the extent of how I feel right now.
He has SHOWN me that he is capable fo shutting me out as he deliberately, after 8 months didnt chat to me for those 3 days then yesterday afternoon when he found out that it wasnt only her honour at stake it was mine also he bothered to ask "do you want to catch up over the weekend and chat?"
At the end of the day no matter what you all say, its not jealousy as Ive already said I know nothing has been going on but he has hurt me more than any gossip or rumours could have by excluding me entirely for the past 3 days. I came to him at least 3 times during the last 2 days asking to please talk and have a coffee. He returned my request with "I dont think now is a good time to talk, I might say something I'll regret later"...WTF? why would he say something to me that he'll regret when I did not start nor get involved in any of these rumours. He told me he was also too busy (suddenly after 8 months?). I did not once mention anything about thinking there was truth to the rumours.
Its nice that the other woman has such a loyal friend looking out for her welfare. I hope she realises how lucky she is.
I am hurt, I am angry and Im sorry but if you're in a relationship the normal thing to do is to be able to communicate and ensure your partner feels safe and happy. He hasnt done any of that and all I wanted was 10 minutes of his time but he was too busy, too busy by taking her out for lunch, too busy coming in late and leaving early.
Whatever, dont worry about it.
Chatz I don't blame you for being upset at all. I'd be furious. Rumors are rumors and they happen BUT your Virgo isn't doing anything to help put a handle on them AND he's not jumping to make YOU feel secure. That most certainly would not fly with me.
Point is they are friends. Ok... but YOU are his GF and should be number one above anyone except children. It is not his responsiblity to drive her every where. It's something he chose to do as a friend. Once these rumors started he should have told her that he'd cool the driving around until things were straightened out. If she didn't have any feeling for him other then freindship she'd be supportive and understanding at that.
By taking her to lunch he is only fueling the flames (and this makes me very suspicious). If he is SO furious about rumors he'd not do something to make the situation go from bad to worse.
Basically he's putting her needs above yours and sweetie that isn't good. He has no justification for doing that unless.... well he's "going there".
What kind of a person is SHE by letting someone else's man take care of her like that without any consideration to you? She sounds needy and helpless or she's after something.
You need to confront him and point out how YOU are feeling in all this. But if it were me the damage would have already been done. If I were in your shoes I'd tell him that she needs to find a ride with someone else and stop going to lunch with him or I'd walk. You don't deserve a relationship that doesn't consider your feelings and someone outside is put before you.
I may get jumped for being paranoid and possessive but once a man is in a relationship with me he's marked territory or he's out on his ass.
Point is they are friends. Ok... but YOU are his GF and should be number one above anyone except children. It is not his responsiblity to drive her every where. It's something he chose to do as a friend. Once these rumors started he should have told her that he'd cool the driving around until things were straightened out. If she didn't have any feeling for him other then freindship she'd be supportive and understanding at that.
By taking her to lunch he is only fueling the flames (and this makes me very suspicious). If he is SO furious about rumors he'd not do something to make the situation go from bad to worse.
Basically he's putting her needs above yours and sweetie that isn't good. He has no justification for doing that unless.... well he's "going there".
What kind of a person is SHE by letting someone else's man take care of her like that without any consideration to you? She sounds needy and helpless or she's after something.
You need to confront him and point out how YOU are feeling in all this. But if it were me the damage would have already been done. If I were in your shoes I'd tell him that she needs to find a ride with someone else and stop going to lunch with him or I'd walk. You don't deserve a relationship that doesn't consider your feelings and someone outside is put before you.
I may get jumped for being paranoid and possessive but once a man is in a relationship with me he's marked territory or he's out on his ass.
Hmmm interesting.
He did call me today and asked if we could talk *gulp* so long story short we met at the local bar and he bought me a drink (he didnt look well at all) and we talked and he straight up said that he was sorry for shutting me out and being a jerk..I didnt say a thing as he apologised over and over and over again. How could I stay mad?
I am still mad internally at the whole situation where we got caught up in peoples' gossip. He even said himself that he'll be doing less for the other girl and she should find out her results this Wednesday (so fingers crossed she'll get her bloody licence back and he can have his life back as it was).
His words "as far as Im concerned, we're still good and to put the record straight I am not seeing anybody else, I dont wish to, you are the only one I want to be with" but of course there's still no label on us and I wasnt expecting that.....I just want loyalty and honesty.
I dunno, Im just relieved that he came to me with this and realised himself what a jackass he had been. For those who think I over-reacted please know that I did not once accuse him, I didnt once whine to him, I didnt once make myself look like the jealous one (that is why I came on here, to vent and to understand as to what he might be thinking during this shut out period, no other reason).
Whether things will run smoothly from now on? who knows but I do look forward to next weekend (we planned this some time ago) where we'll be going into town to watch a comedy act, dinner, drinks, walk through the mall and spend all Sunday in bed LOL.
Yeah!!!!
I cant say Im over the moon because it has been a taxing few days but Im relieved to know that I didnt make a fool of myself and I didnt have to ask for an apology - he had obviously thought it through quite well.
mental note: Let him think things through in his own time (normally 3-4 days it takes) and stop bloody worrying
He did call me today and asked if we could talk *gulp* so long story short we met at the local bar and he bought me a drink (he didnt look well at all) and we talked and he straight up said that he was sorry for shutting me out and being a jerk..I didnt say a thing as he apologised over and over and over again. How could I stay mad?
I am still mad internally at the whole situation where we got caught up in peoples' gossip. He even said himself that he'll be doing less for the other girl and she should find out her results this Wednesday (so fingers crossed she'll get her bloody licence back and he can have his life back as it was).
His words "as far as Im concerned, we're still good and to put the record straight I am not seeing anybody else, I dont wish to, you are the only one I want to be with" but of course there's still no label on us and I wasnt expecting that.....I just want loyalty and honesty.
I dunno, Im just relieved that he came to me with this and realised himself what a jackass he had been. For those who think I over-reacted please know that I did not once accuse him, I didnt once whine to him, I didnt once make myself look like the jealous one (that is why I came on here, to vent and to understand as to what he might be thinking during this shut out period, no other reason).
Whether things will run smoothly from now on? who knows but I do look forward to next weekend (we planned this some time ago) where we'll be going into town to watch a comedy act, dinner, drinks, walk through the mall and spend all Sunday in bed LOL.
Yeah!!!!
I cant say Im over the moon because it has been a taxing few days but Im relieved to know that I didnt make a fool of myself and I didnt have to ask for an apology - he had obviously thought it through quite well.
mental note: Let him think things through in his own time (normally 3-4 days it takes) and stop bloody worrying
yammi....your next weekend plans... :-)
I think your ignoring a few red flags Chatz, this guy is NOT ready and you will struggle, you are investing a ton of time on a man that most likely will not make you feel cherished as things get more serious, you can choose to stay and play it out but not to put a damper...he aint it
also I have to agree with Ginger, she made some very valid points that can' t be ignored, there was something not sure how deep or how small but something was going on between him and that woman, maybe she grew feelings and he had to sort it all out, spending that much time together alone, having a man drive her around she most likely caught some feelings for him, it's hard not to like someone that is going out of his way to help.
"I am still mad internally at the whole situation where we got caught up in peoples' gossip."
Correct .. ((( you ))) were caught up in other peoples gossip.
"he took her in his car alone the very afternoon for a lunch break when he told me in his words "Im about to go to lunch with the gang"....there they were walking to the car alone, he took off with her alone, they came back and hour and a half alone. He has gone to lunch with her the entire week (just that day alone though)...."
How do you know that ^^^^ ..... 1. a stalker, or 2. you were caught up in gossip
Here's your answer, Chatz ....
"but of course there's still no label on us and I wasnt expecting that.....I just want loyalty and honesty."
The problem here is that you are expecting loyalty and honesty, without any label = no committment. You are not his girlfriend to whom he has to answer to without this commitment to honour you, Chatz .... so, you have no grounds to expect loyalty.
This is the whole problem here .... you want him to act like he is, when he isn't. If he wants no labels on this relationship to say ((((((partners/couple)))))) ... then he is free to take any woman he chooses anywhere he chooses ..... even to his bed ... and you have no grounds to say/do anything, no matter how bad it hurts ... your position is to understand and keep smiling.
"I came to him at least 3 times during the last 2 days asking to please talk and have a coffee. He returned my request with "I dont think now is a good time to talk, I might say something I'll regret later"...WTF? why would he say something to me that he'll regret when I did not start nor get involved in any of these rumours."
Interesting ... sort of loops back full circle now, doesn't it. Question is, can you comprehend it. He realizes that these "talks" you wanted to have were about his comings and goings with this girl, Chatz .. because you are expecting loyalty and honesty from a man to whom hasn't even agreed to be your boyfriend exclusively yet. And him telling you this being unsensitive to your feelings is what he meant by saying something he would regret.
Think about that ^^^^^ for what it is, rather than what you want to think it is because your feelings are present.
He owes you NOTHING .. you do realize that, don't you?
He could bring a woman to his bed tonight and would owe you absolutely zilch, not an answer, not being sensitive your feelings .. nothing.
Correct .. ((( you ))) were caught up in other peoples gossip.
"he took her in his car alone the very afternoon for a lunch break when he told me in his words "Im about to go to lunch with the gang"....there they were walking to the car alone, he took off with her alone, they came back and hour and a half alone. He has gone to lunch with her the entire week (just that day alone though)...."
How do you know that ^^^^ ..... 1. a stalker, or 2. you were caught up in gossip
Here's your answer, Chatz ....
"but of course there's still no label on us and I wasnt expecting that.....I just want loyalty and honesty."
The problem here is that you are expecting loyalty and honesty, without any label = no committment. You are not his girlfriend to whom he has to answer to without this commitment to honour you, Chatz .... so, you have no grounds to expect loyalty.
This is the whole problem here .... you want him to act like he is, when he isn't. If he wants no labels on this relationship to say ((((((partners/couple)))))) ... then he is free to take any woman he chooses anywhere he chooses ..... even to his bed ... and you have no grounds to say/do anything, no matter how bad it hurts ... your position is to understand and keep smiling.
"I came to him at least 3 times during the last 2 days asking to please talk and have a coffee. He returned my request with "I dont think now is a good time to talk, I might say something I'll regret later"...WTF? why would he say something to me that he'll regret when I did not start nor get involved in any of these rumours."
Interesting ... sort of loops back full circle now, doesn't it. Question is, can you comprehend it. He realizes that these "talks" you wanted to have were about his comings and goings with this girl, Chatz .. because you are expecting loyalty and honesty from a man to whom hasn't even agreed to be your boyfriend exclusively yet. And him telling you this being unsensitive to your feelings is what he meant by saying something he would regret.
Think about that ^^^^^ for what it is, rather than what you want to think it is because your feelings are present.
He owes you NOTHING .. you do realize that, don't you?
He could bring a woman to his bed tonight and would owe you absolutely zilch, not an answer, not being sensitive your feelings .. nothing.
I would agree with Ginger, and Tiki .... if this man were in a commited relationship with you.
Until that happens ... he is a free man ...
Until that happens ... he is a free man ...
Just as I am free to do the same. I understand that for sure 
As far as the feelings this girl might have? I did actually say something of that nature but not so bluntly. I did mention that she is young, vulnerable and because of her neurotic ways (she pops more pills for depression, etc than any person twice her age) she may think there's more to his caring nature than just doing something nice....she is 20, he is twice her age and yes he is doing the typical Virgo thing and being helpful yada yada (I get that) and no I totally believe he wouldnt go there, that nothing has been going on and nothing will go on. He did say "good point" when I raised the above but i did it in a non-accusing way and he did take it on board, in fact I could see that he hadnt thought about it at all how it might be.
I realise that he's still not in the right place and Tiki, Im not deluding myself (not after Mr Libra LOL) but until now he has put so much time into me and us. I doubt he's seeing others but if he is? well yes he does have a right to do that unless/until he makes us exclusive. I wont sit around forever waiting (be assured of that) and realise that perhaps I too need to start dating others again - I dont know, its not something I feel i have to do but you're right, he can take any other woman to bed if that is what he chooses
In regard to knowing the other girl went to lunch with him? well they were walking to his car as I was walking to mine. I know they go their own separate ways once they go there to the shops as they have done time and time again - they normally go out as a group but it happens that the others were offsite so I guess they just carried on as per usual. I didnt make a big point of it.
Im taking myself away from being able to communicate with him every day all day by the communicator tool (its like msn) and perhaps just pulling myself away from him and my feelings towards him as perhaps he really just is being a good friend and enjoys my company when we do see one another. I do wish though, he'd stop giving me mixed signals by wining and dining and buying me gifts and making plans for the future, and wanting me to go here and there with him if he has no intention of seeing this through in the long term. I dont think even he knows what he's doing and how his actions are confusing the hell out of me.
He did say he wasnt seeing anybody else, that he had no intention of it but what men say and do??
As far as the feelings this girl might have? I did actually say something of that nature but not so bluntly. I did mention that she is young, vulnerable and because of her neurotic ways (she pops more pills for depression, etc than any person twice her age) she may think there's more to his caring nature than just doing something nice....she is 20, he is twice her age and yes he is doing the typical Virgo thing and being helpful yada yada (I get that) and no I totally believe he wouldnt go there, that nothing has been going on and nothing will go on. He did say "good point" when I raised the above but i did it in a non-accusing way and he did take it on board, in fact I could see that he hadnt thought about it at all how it might be.
I realise that he's still not in the right place and Tiki, Im not deluding myself (not after Mr Libra LOL) but until now he has put so much time into me and us. I doubt he's seeing others but if he is? well yes he does have a right to do that unless/until he makes us exclusive. I wont sit around forever waiting (be assured of that) and realise that perhaps I too need to start dating others again - I dont know, its not something I feel i have to do but you're right, he can take any other woman to bed if that is what he chooses
In regard to knowing the other girl went to lunch with him? well they were walking to his car as I was walking to mine. I know they go their own separate ways once they go there to the shops as they have done time and time again - they normally go out as a group but it happens that the others were offsite so I guess they just carried on as per usual. I didnt make a big point of it.
Im taking myself away from being able to communicate with him every day all day by the communicator tool (its like msn) and perhaps just pulling myself away from him and my feelings towards him as perhaps he really just is being a good friend and enjoys my company when we do see one another. I do wish though, he'd stop giving me mixed signals by wining and dining and buying me gifts and making plans for the future, and wanting me to go here and there with him if he has no intention of seeing this through in the long term. I dont think even he knows what he's doing and how his actions are confusing the hell out of me.
He did say he wasnt seeing anybody else, that he had no intention of it but what men say and do??
As I said, I think its best we cut the daily communication out and that way I wont know what he's doing as if he were working somewhere else and Id not have a clue. He's not a bad man and he isnt out to hurt me, he's just not in the right place and still loves his wife very much....I cant compete with a ghost and I shouldnt be threatened by gossip and I need to shake myself up a bit as this is what the office gossip was all about - to cause pain to innocent people.
Im going to keep to myself for a while and allow him to live his life as if I dont exist....we have next weekend which I look forward to but after that? I dont know. I'm sure if he misses me he'll come looking.
Probably doing both of us a favour by keeping a distance for a while.....if there is something with this girl or any other woman? I will give him his space
Im going to keep to myself for a while and allow him to live his life as if I dont exist....we have next weekend which I look forward to but after that? I dont know. I'm sure if he misses me he'll come looking.
Probably doing both of us a favour by keeping a distance for a while.....if there is something with this girl or any other woman? I will give him his space
Chatz, you have every right to be suspicious. He should have told you BEFORE hand what was going on before taking the risk of you hearing gossip from someone else about it.
First of all, I don't believe in the "oh it's innocent" bs. For one, if it was so innocent, then why not tell it? Not saying he has to disclose every single thing and repeat every single conversation he has at work, but when it comes to what could possibly turned into something bigger than it is, he should have gave you the heads-up.
First of all, I don't believe in the "oh it's innocent" bs. For one, if it was so innocent, then why not tell it? Not saying he has to disclose every single thing and repeat every single conversation he has at work, but when it comes to what could possibly turned into something bigger than it is, he should have gave you the heads-up.
Yes but the gossip isnt only about him, its about all of the guys that take her home and pick her up in the mornings...its not only directed at him. He's gotten a little closer than most though because he's a Virgo, they care damnit LOL. He probably is just being that fatherly figure or big brother thing and he doesnt think that there's anything wrong with that.
There has been no commitment of g/f-b/f between us but he has told me that intimately we are exclusive, that he's not seeing anybody else - I guess I have to believe that but the others are right, given that there is no other serious commitment, I am not safe from somebody else getting between us and this gossip thing has NOT at all helped.
The best thing for me to do is back away for a while....perhaps us chatting so much everyday makes him feel he's given me enough of his time (any time spent is time right??) so he doesnt feel he has to "entertain" me constantly in his free time giving him all the time in the world to watch his beloved movies LOL.
Tiki, you've always told me what I just realised.....dont put so much time in, give the gift of missing me and thats what Im about to put into action. The chatting will stop - afterall, it was him who shut me out the last 4 days so he wont miss it if I get on with my work and life as it clearly seems we are just a FWB scenario (as much as he's trying to say thats not the case).
Other than that, I just do NOT know what to be but to remain the person I was prior to all this pathetic gossip going around about a young girl giving favours to 10 odd people driving her to and from work.
P-Angel, although you put it so bluntly, you are right as well, if I become complicated and make demands (which I havent) I will push him away....me backing off will hopefully do the opposite.
I wont lose sight of what he does bring into my life and thats a great deal of laughter and fun when we are together, he does the sweetest things like tapes movies I might like to watch, he'll lend me movies he's bought and takes me to the movies, dinners, drives through the hills, this next weekend coming up, etc, etc. If he didnt want to do that he wouldnt and I have to go back to basics and appreciate it for what it is and continue to reciprocate as much as I can...I dunno, its a confusing situation and Im doing the best I can.
I just hope she gets the all clear from her doctor so she can drive again after Wednesday
There has been no commitment of g/f-b/f between us but he has told me that intimately we are exclusive, that he's not seeing anybody else - I guess I have to believe that but the others are right, given that there is no other serious commitment, I am not safe from somebody else getting between us and this gossip thing has NOT at all helped.
The best thing for me to do is back away for a while....perhaps us chatting so much everyday makes him feel he's given me enough of his time (any time spent is time right??) so he doesnt feel he has to "entertain" me constantly in his free time giving him all the time in the world to watch his beloved movies LOL.
Tiki, you've always told me what I just realised.....dont put so much time in, give the gift of missing me and thats what Im about to put into action. The chatting will stop - afterall, it was him who shut me out the last 4 days so he wont miss it if I get on with my work and life as it clearly seems we are just a FWB scenario (as much as he's trying to say thats not the case).
Other than that, I just do NOT know what to be but to remain the person I was prior to all this pathetic gossip going around about a young girl giving favours to 10 odd people driving her to and from work.
P-Angel, although you put it so bluntly, you are right as well, if I become complicated and make demands (which I havent) I will push him away....me backing off will hopefully do the opposite.
I wont lose sight of what he does bring into my life and thats a great deal of laughter and fun when we are together, he does the sweetest things like tapes movies I might like to watch, he'll lend me movies he's bought and takes me to the movies, dinners, drives through the hills, this next weekend coming up, etc, etc. If he didnt want to do that he wouldnt and I have to go back to basics and appreciate it for what it is and continue to reciprocate as much as I can...I dunno, its a confusing situation and Im doing the best I can.
I just hope she gets the all clear from her doctor so she can drive again after Wednesday
Start dating Chatz, this will build attraction and let's face it, if he's not willing to be exclusive then there is no need for you to fall into the girlfriend trap, don't sit around WAITING for a relationship, waiting for him to decide you are worth more, you are worth more but only you can show him that. Get up..Go out and date other men, let him know that you agree exclusivity for sex is with him but he can't have his cake and eat to, I know you don't believe there is much going on between him and that woman but THERE IS, I'm telling you there is, it may not be full blown but there is something or he wouldn't have allowed you to believe it and let's say there is nothing there very fact that he only wanted to communicate on his terms is another red flag for you, don't miss these red flags Chatz, you keep thinking with your heart, USE YOUR HEAD. He's not ready, he's not your boyfriend which means to alleviate pressure on you and him go out and find a better man, a man that is open to doing a relationship, the one you have isn't...He's comfortable, he's getting sex, he's getting a relationship on HIS terms which means disaster and heartbreak for you.
I would suggest in the future, STOP BEING EXCLUSIVE with men that can't do a relationship, I don't care if you like him, if he can't give you more, if he's so wounded that he wouldn't fathom giving you your dream then throw him in the defect pile, occassional good time pile and move on.
This guy is flawed for whatever reason, flawed enough that he won't give you what you deserve, if you stick around he will accept things as they are but he has no intentions of giving more or he would have done it, men that are in love, truly head over heels in love will throw it all the way for the woman they love, bachelors, players, womanizers, widowers if he's in love he will not stop until your his...Understand?? He's not ready and your leading yourself down the path of heartbreak road
If he sits by and allows you to date other men and not feel threatened enough to DO something about it like give you what you clearly are worth then he's not your dream man, he's not the man that is up for the job...
I would suggest in the future, STOP BEING EXCLUSIVE with men that can't do a relationship, I don't care if you like him, if he can't give you more, if he's so wounded that he wouldn't fathom giving you your dream then throw him in the defect pile, occassional good time pile and move on.
This guy is flawed for whatever reason, flawed enough that he won't give you what you deserve, if you stick around he will accept things as they are but he has no intentions of giving more or he would have done it, men that are in love, truly head over heels in love will throw it all the way for the woman they love, bachelors, players, womanizers, widowers if he's in love he will not stop until your his...Understand?? He's not ready and your leading yourself down the path of heartbreak road
If he sits by and allows you to date other men and not feel threatened enough to DO something about it like give you what you clearly are worth then he's not your dream man, he's not the man that is up for the job...
I partially disagree with Tiki, and partially agree.
I disagree about the part of saying there's something going on between him and the other female because that can only be speculated. If Chatz says he's the "servant" type person, he may feel like he has a personal committment to help others who are poor or weak in his opinion. It might be that he's helping this woman out of obligation, and his payment for this comes in the form of a sense of personal satisfaction that can only be felt by someone who feels they have done something to help someone else.
I agree that Chatz should move on with keeping her dating options open since this thing with this guy has not been made official. There is no sense in wasting time and energy on something that could or could not blossom into something more. The worse case scenerio that could happen is while Chatz is dating someone, the guy snaps out of it and decides to commit to Chatz, which would create a problem with the new date.
Chatz, it seems like he's just a giving person. Whether it's because of his Virgo nature or not, you're going to have to use logic and reasoning to figure out if this is the kind of person you are willing to put up with. There is no one woman or man on this earth that comes fully equipped without flaws. So ask yourself... would you be willing to accept this man AS HE IS?
I disagree about the part of saying there's something going on between him and the other female because that can only be speculated. If Chatz says he's the "servant" type person, he may feel like he has a personal committment to help others who are poor or weak in his opinion. It might be that he's helping this woman out of obligation, and his payment for this comes in the form of a sense of personal satisfaction that can only be felt by someone who feels they have done something to help someone else.
I agree that Chatz should move on with keeping her dating options open since this thing with this guy has not been made official. There is no sense in wasting time and energy on something that could or could not blossom into something more. The worse case scenerio that could happen is while Chatz is dating someone, the guy snaps out of it and decides to commit to Chatz, which would create a problem with the new date.
Chatz, it seems like he's just a giving person. Whether it's because of his Virgo nature or not, you're going to have to use logic and reasoning to figure out if this is the kind of person you are willing to put up with. There is no one woman or man on this earth that comes fully equipped without flaws. So ask yourself... would you be willing to accept this man AS HE IS?
I didn't say HOW he was involved, it could be emotional, it could be partially physical and more emotional or nothing at all never the less he chose to not communicate with Chatz during a time when it was clear she was distressed and needed understanding and that alone is a RED FLAG, to care about another womans feelings over hers is a huge red flag that he's taking her for granted, women have the gift of that nudging feeling in her gut that says something isn't right, it doesn't always have to be confirmed that he was inappropriate, if your feeling insecure thats enough to know that this man may not be the right fit, if Chatz wants to believe it's a help sort of action on his part and it helps her deal with it then she has to do what she has to do to swallow that pill.
If the guy hasn't made a full-fledged committment to Chatz, it doesn't matter what level of involvement he is with this other chic anyways. All I'm saying is EVENTUALLY, all has to come to light and if this guy is trying to put himself in a predicament that allows some level of attachment to form with this female he's with, it cannot be said that was his intentions in the first place IF the level of involvement hasn't been correctly identified yet. It may be that this guy is really compassionate about this other female's situation... and that is all.
But yes, I do agree it is wrong for him to blow off Chatz... that is definetly a red flag and not necessarily because of another female. That there says that he is and always will be only concerned about himself, his wants, his needs, will always undeniably priority over any and every thing else. Including people. So if he's doing this act for this other female out for recogniztion, he's got all that he needs and wants at the moment. If more blossoms, which sometimes it usually does, so be it. Some people are attracted to "broken" people because it's a sign of vulnerability, especially if the person is an emotional control freak.
But yes, I do agree it is wrong for him to blow off Chatz... that is definetly a red flag and not necessarily because of another female. That there says that he is and always will be only concerned about himself, his wants, his needs, will always undeniably priority over any and every thing else. Including people. So if he's doing this act for this other female out for recogniztion, he's got all that he needs and wants at the moment. If more blossoms, which sometimes it usually does, so be it. Some people are attracted to "broken" people because it's a sign of vulnerability, especially if the person is an emotional control freak.
Understood and accepted thank you all. I will be honouring my date with him NEXT Saturday night but will be taking away the daily communication. He can take it any way he likes...he took that away from me over the last few day by disappearing, by totally eradicating me from his life. To say "I dont want to say something I'll regret"? that hurt coz what could he possibly say to upset me and why? anyway, he said that and its for me to figure out what it meant.
It was all very pleasant last night and he did make the effort which IM grateful for as I could finally get SOME indication as to what was going on. BUT as I said, Im going to do my disappearing act and show him what life is like again without me....I doubt he'll notice to be honest, I doubt it'll sink in and I doubt the lunches with the group wont change (and they shouldnt) nor will the picking her up and dropping her home until such time (if) she gets the go ahead to drive again. NOTHING will change, he'll still be her hero for as long as she wants/needs and she wont feel bad for asking or accepting.
There is a slim chance she is actually starting to see her ex again...his words last night so that might squash all the rumours.
I dont know but youre all right, if I was that important to him he'd have moved heaven and earth to make it right between ALL parties, not just her.
Im not angry but just disappointed I had to find out this way that Im not that important, and basically just someone he enjoys spending his free time with, nothing more. Id have hoped his feelings would have grown but they simply havent and youre all right again, they may never and I could be wasting precious time hanging for a man who wont ever commit.
Sad but true
It was all very pleasant last night and he did make the effort which IM grateful for as I could finally get SOME indication as to what was going on. BUT as I said, Im going to do my disappearing act and show him what life is like again without me....I doubt he'll notice to be honest, I doubt it'll sink in and I doubt the lunches with the group wont change (and they shouldnt) nor will the picking her up and dropping her home until such time (if) she gets the go ahead to drive again. NOTHING will change, he'll still be her hero for as long as she wants/needs and she wont feel bad for asking or accepting.
There is a slim chance she is actually starting to see her ex again...his words last night so that might squash all the rumours.
I dont know but youre all right, if I was that important to him he'd have moved heaven and earth to make it right between ALL parties, not just her.
Im not angry but just disappointed I had to find out this way that Im not that important, and basically just someone he enjoys spending his free time with, nothing more. Id have hoped his feelings would have grown but they simply havent and youre all right again, they may never and I could be wasting precious time hanging for a man who wont ever commit.
Sad but true
I have never seen such pride and self-deceptive, compromising, full of jealousy and lies,
Insecure, unrighteous competing posts ever??_
What are you trying to justify here?
Yourself or your supposedly male companion behaviours? There are no commitments between you two still you take privilege to come in here with the usual excuse (vent out) just to defame and dehumanize another Virgo male...?
I don??t know about the others but do you think any sane human going to buy your (definitely) false story?
Listen??_.
There is something called (free will) in every human being??_ free to do what ever they wish for, if he chose to be with his female companion for whatever reason in his working/free time then it is his own choice same goes to you too.
This is one sided story with one sided answers when nobody knows anything about the other side of the window.
Insecure, unrighteous competing posts ever??_
What are you trying to justify here?
Yourself or your supposedly male companion behaviours? There are no commitments between you two still you take privilege to come in here with the usual excuse (vent out) just to defame and dehumanize another Virgo male...?
I don??t know about the others but do you think any sane human going to buy your (definitely) false story?
Listen??_.
There is something called (free will) in every human being??_ free to do what ever they wish for, if he chose to be with his female companion for whatever reason in his working/free time then it is his own choice same goes to you too.
This is one sided story with one sided answers when nobody knows anything about the other side of the window.
Be fair..?
She should have known that the Virgo is a sign of service as well (not the service you??ll get in public or restaurants) but self sacrificing in favour and benefits of others in close circle.
What has been done here was the act of Virgos NATURE and nothing more, she wouldn??t get hurt if she wasn??t controlling and thinking (WTF) all the time.
Reread her posts without negative judgments against her (Imaginary) BF and you??ll get the same as I did.
She should have known that the Virgo is a sign of service as well (not the service you??ll get in public or restaurants) but self sacrificing in favour and benefits of others in close circle.
What has been done here was the act of Virgos NATURE and nothing more, she wouldn??t get hurt if she wasn??t controlling and thinking (WTF) all the time.
Reread her posts without negative judgments against her (Imaginary) BF and you??ll get the same as I did.
He has chosen not to talk to me now in fear "he might say something he'll regret later"...WTF??
Like all gentleman will do to stop OVER REACTION process but chatz wouldn??t even give a damn for what he meant.
Like I said, dehumanize, demonize, defaming Virgos like all others do as long as I remember.
Like all gentleman will do to stop OVER REACTION process but chatz wouldn??t even give a damn for what he meant.
Like I said, dehumanize, demonize, defaming Virgos like all others do as long as I remember.
Gossip is gossip - dont listen to it.
Gossip has spoiled many relationships.
Trust the person until youre given cause not too.
Believe me, if the gossip is true or not, if youre being cheated on
youll "feel it"
The rest is up to you
Gossip has spoiled many relationships.
Trust the person until youre given cause not too.
Believe me, if the gossip is true or not, if youre being cheated on
youll "feel it"
The rest is up to you
thank you all for your advice, criticism and positive feedback. Yes you're right, there are 2 sides but I do believe some of you have read this all wrong or I have written it all wrong.
You have pointed out to me though, and over this weekend, I have come to realise that I am only clutching at straws and that what I have with this man is nothing more than a casual relationship where we hook up when he feels like it. Im so eager to see him because I genuinely care for him but he only sees me when he's not busy with his mates or whatever else he does with his time. He seeks a companion who doesnt want more than what he's giving me.
As much as I care for him he does not feel the same way and I will remain to be friends and just keep it that way - I can ill afford to spend yet another year on a man who is commitment phobic, who gives mixed messages....to keep it short, I will set him free so that My "controlling ways" wont get in the way of his happiness.
I am the only one who is emotionally invested and therefore I have to walk away from the "whatever it is relationship" and remain friends as I do not wish to lose that.
Thank you for everybodys thoughts.
You have pointed out to me though, and over this weekend, I have come to realise that I am only clutching at straws and that what I have with this man is nothing more than a casual relationship where we hook up when he feels like it. Im so eager to see him because I genuinely care for him but he only sees me when he's not busy with his mates or whatever else he does with his time. He seeks a companion who doesnt want more than what he's giving me.
As much as I care for him he does not feel the same way and I will remain to be friends and just keep it that way - I can ill afford to spend yet another year on a man who is commitment phobic, who gives mixed messages....to keep it short, I will set him free so that My "controlling ways" wont get in the way of his happiness.
I am the only one who is emotionally invested and therefore I have to walk away from the "whatever it is relationship" and remain friends as I do not wish to lose that.
Thank you for everybodys thoughts.
Just because a man decides that you are not The One .. doesn't make him a commitment phobic.
"I can ill afford to spend yet another year on a man who is commitment phobic, who gives mixed messages"
Why would you be excited about whether she replies to it or not, Brad?
When I said that, I wasn't expecting a reply .... it was a statement for any person to read who chose to, and not really anticipating a response.
This man is in love with his deceased wife, and Chatz knows this ....... the wife is The One for him still. It has nothing to do with him having a commitment phobia, it has to do with him not being healed yet from losing the love of his life.
I get damn tired of women coming in here and making the assertion that a man has commitment phobia simply because he has decided that she isn't The One ... as if a man doesn't have this right to choose who is the one for him, and ain't he a fool for not seeing that she is a prize.
And that is how when women say this .. they make it sound when they say it.
He doesn't have commitment phobia and she isn't a prize that he's missing out on.
He is still in love with his wife and hasn't healed past this yet.
And Chatz knows .. she fucking KNOWS .... her role in this was to heal this man, to show him that it's ok to love again and then move on .. that was her place, and she knew it. Instead, she stayed to have expectations that this man was suppose to prove to her that he is healing to satisfy her inherent weakness = ego.
Why would you be excited about whether she replies to it or not, Brad?
When I said that, I wasn't expecting a reply .... it was a statement for any person to read who chose to, and not really anticipating a response.
This man is in love with his deceased wife, and Chatz knows this ....... the wife is The One for him still. It has nothing to do with him having a commitment phobia, it has to do with him not being healed yet from losing the love of his life.
I get damn tired of women coming in here and making the assertion that a man has commitment phobia simply because he has decided that she isn't The One ... as if a man doesn't have this right to choose who is the one for him, and ain't he a fool for not seeing that she is a prize.
And that is how when women say this .. they make it sound when they say it.
He doesn't have commitment phobia and she isn't a prize that he's missing out on.
He is still in love with his wife and hasn't healed past this yet.
And Chatz knows .. she fucking KNOWS .... her role in this was to heal this man, to show him that it's ok to love again and then move on .. that was her place, and she knew it. Instead, she stayed to have expectations that this man was suppose to prove to her that he is healing to satisfy her inherent weakness = ego.
Him showing this other girl attention, Chatz knew was going to happen ... as all Leo women know is going to happen.
That's why they are suppose to fix, and then leave .. not fucking stay.
Her pain is her own cross to bear .... she broke the rules of her mission.
That's why they are suppose to fix, and then leave .. not fucking stay.
Her pain is her own cross to bear .... she broke the rules of her mission.
Withdrawing sex usually separates the men from the boys. Lol..if all this is going on the sex is only confusing the situation. Let him do whatever he needs to get over this hurt. You just get on with your life..
I haven't had a loved one die so not sure how he must be feeling. Can't really comment. But life goes on, people move on. If you can't hack a relationship don't get into one. If you must, expect emotions..we are human beings. We have them. If you can't handle them, go take a running jump for all I care.
I haven't had a loved one die so not sure how he must be feeling. Can't really comment. But life goes on, people move on. If you can't hack a relationship don't get into one. If you must, expect emotions..we are human beings. We have them. If you can't handle them, go take a running jump for all I care.
ok ok when I said he is "commitment phobic"...he said those words HIMSELF, he told me he was finding himself after most of his life being in long term relationships/marriage. He doesnt really know what he wants and thats fair enough.
I have been doing as I said I would, remaining his friend throughout the ordeal (I came here to get advice initially and I appreciate it and yes I did vent, we all do from time to time). Yesterday Mr Virgo came to me and told ME what a jerk he'd been, that he should have obtained all the facts before going off on a tangent and shutting me out or anybody out for that matter....I said nothing to make him do that...HE came to ME.
He wants to continue seeing me and has asked me out twice this week to which I have declined because I am actualy busy with other things so third time lucky he offered to take me for a bike ride in the hills on Sunday after our Saturday night date....I havent accepted yet but Id like to.
My friendship with him is a wonderful one (so that is why I didnt understand him shuttin me out) and I dont want to lose that....I didnt accuse him of anything with the other girl, she is like a daughter to him for Godsake although yes I was hurt that he didnt want to discuss the gossip with me....I guess he has his own reasons.
Im not disappointed I "didnt get the guy" because I still have that option perhaps, who knows. Im not walking away from him but I am starting to live my life in a new direction and remaining busy and not hoping that he'll want to spend more time with me. As was said, freedom of choice? I also can date other men, Ive started playing mixed netball, and I have a lot of home improvements going on around my house right now that I will be extremely busy - he's interested in all of that also so Im sure he'll put his advice in amongst it all LOL.
I may have come into his life to help him mend and then he'll move on, thats fine too but it would be a great loss to lose his friendship. What will be will be.
I merely came on here to try to understand as to why he would block out somebody who has been a constant figure in his life for the past 8 odd months because of office gossip and yes I did get worried about the other woman, I admit it, Im sure if the tables were turned you'd ALL get a little jittery even though you KNEW he'd not go there.
Im only human and I will make mistakes - Im not a Virgo LOL
I have been doing as I said I would, remaining his friend throughout the ordeal (I came here to get advice initially and I appreciate it and yes I did vent, we all do from time to time). Yesterday Mr Virgo came to me and told ME what a jerk he'd been, that he should have obtained all the facts before going off on a tangent and shutting me out or anybody out for that matter....I said nothing to make him do that...HE came to ME.
He wants to continue seeing me and has asked me out twice this week to which I have declined because I am actualy busy with other things so third time lucky he offered to take me for a bike ride in the hills on Sunday after our Saturday night date....I havent accepted yet but Id like to.
My friendship with him is a wonderful one (so that is why I didnt understand him shuttin me out) and I dont want to lose that....I didnt accuse him of anything with the other girl, she is like a daughter to him for Godsake although yes I was hurt that he didnt want to discuss the gossip with me....I guess he has his own reasons.
Im not disappointed I "didnt get the guy" because I still have that option perhaps, who knows. Im not walking away from him but I am starting to live my life in a new direction and remaining busy and not hoping that he'll want to spend more time with me. As was said, freedom of choice? I also can date other men, Ive started playing mixed netball, and I have a lot of home improvements going on around my house right now that I will be extremely busy - he's interested in all of that also so Im sure he'll put his advice in amongst it all LOL.
I may have come into his life to help him mend and then he'll move on, thats fine too but it would be a great loss to lose his friendship. What will be will be.
I merely came on here to try to understand as to why he would block out somebody who has been a constant figure in his life for the past 8 odd months because of office gossip and yes I did get worried about the other woman, I admit it, Im sure if the tables were turned you'd ALL get a little jittery even though you KNEW he'd not go there.
Im only human and I will make mistakes - Im not a Virgo LOL
Rinse .. repeat
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
Fire signs ... what gets them exed the quickest with a virgo.
which is a win-win situation because the fire signs cannot afford the extent of patience needed to handle a Virgo.
The other point is stagnancy. This has been mentioned as one of the frequent reasons why Fire signs and Virgos do appart. After a few years, not months.
a man will go the way he needs to go if the woman stops ENABLING and hanging on expecting an end result, end results scare some men.....if having a relationship is part of what you value then it's no need to hang on waiting for a real relationship...Go out and LIVE!
No Im not married and Im not exactly looking for marriage either....perhaps on the cards one day but Im in no hurry to go down that road.
To be honest I think I handled the whole situation as well as most women would have but in having said that, if he isnt interested in more? Ive already worked on changing my schedule so I am busy and if and when he asks to do things? Im going to have to say no to him and refuse to change my plans with others because he didnt get in early enough. I will date others, I am staying busy at work, at home with renovations and Im going out with friends, Ive also joined a mixed netball team in the last few days and yes he has asked me to go out 3 times yesterday (2 I have declined because I am busy).
It is him who is chasing now and Im not lifting a finger...not because Im being a bitch, not because Im being mean but I am simply not chasing as its clear that is what he doesnt want/need and I dont want to be hurt. Im going to live my life as if we are simply friends...he wants more? he'll come and get it.
I genuinely like the man...I think some of you have a really bad impression that Im going to hold the last few days against him forever....to be totally honest, Im utterly over it, as is he and as is the other girl in question....Im moving on and am happy. I only came on here to understand the pushing away thing.
I understand it, its simple, its not rocket science and Ive taken a LOT on board over the past few days.
Its interesting to see an outsider's perspective and unfortunately NOBODY can see the dynamics that are there or not written in a few paragraphs. Your advice, support and criticism is appreciated but I think this thread needs to die coz I havent lost a thing...just needed to understand
Thank you
To be honest I think I handled the whole situation as well as most women would have but in having said that, if he isnt interested in more? Ive already worked on changing my schedule so I am busy and if and when he asks to do things? Im going to have to say no to him and refuse to change my plans with others because he didnt get in early enough. I will date others, I am staying busy at work, at home with renovations and Im going out with friends, Ive also joined a mixed netball team in the last few days and yes he has asked me to go out 3 times yesterday (2 I have declined because I am busy).
It is him who is chasing now and Im not lifting a finger...not because Im being a bitch, not because Im being mean but I am simply not chasing as its clear that is what he doesnt want/need and I dont want to be hurt. Im going to live my life as if we are simply friends...he wants more? he'll come and get it.
I genuinely like the man...I think some of you have a really bad impression that Im going to hold the last few days against him forever....to be totally honest, Im utterly over it, as is he and as is the other girl in question....Im moving on and am happy. I only came on here to understand the pushing away thing.
I understand it, its simple, its not rocket science and Ive taken a LOT on board over the past few days.
Its interesting to see an outsider's perspective and unfortunately NOBODY can see the dynamics that are there or not written in a few paragraphs. Your advice, support and criticism is appreciated but I think this thread needs to die coz I havent lost a thing...just needed to understand
Thank you
Last time she went out, it wasn't to live ..... it was intended on trying re-capture him back to her .. in other words to play hard to get.
That's not really living .. it's playing.
I guess playing could be considered a part of living ... but, not appealing to most people. Sure, men will play along so long as the bed is a part of it ... but, pretty much the line is drawn there.
I knew this want-to-be relationship was doomed as soon as she started the thread ...
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
... in February. Virgo's behaviour was clearly an indication that he was playing her game of attention for his own personal benefit .. she didn't believe me.
Bet she does now.
That's not really living .. it's playing.
I guess playing could be considered a part of living ... but, not appealing to most people. Sure, men will play along so long as the bed is a part of it ... but, pretty much the line is drawn there.
I knew this want-to-be relationship was doomed as soon as she started the thread ...
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
... in February. Virgo's behaviour was clearly an indication that he was playing her game of attention for his own personal benefit .. she didn't believe me.
Bet she does now.
"It is him who is chasing now and Im not lifting a finger."
Of course he is after you decided to play hard to get ... just like last time ..
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
Rinse ... repeat
You didn't lift a finger last time and thought yourself to be princess ... look where it got you .. maybe it hasn't dawned on you yet .. sobeit.
A repeat of this thread is eminant in about 3 to 4 weeks.
Of course he is after you decided to play hard to get ... just like last time ..
http://www.dxpnet.com/opinion/messages.asp?id=1600965
Rinse ... repeat
You didn't lift a finger last time and thought yourself to be princess ... look where it got you .. maybe it hasn't dawned on you yet .. sobeit.
A repeat of this thread is eminant in about 3 to 4 weeks.
Im not playing hard to get, why should I? If he doesnt want me then Im not going to MAKE him by being stupid....thats just being pathetic but Im sure as hell am NOT going to chase anymore.
I never played hard to get once. Im simply living my life now...If he wants to be a part of it? AWESOME (and it would seem he does), if he doesnt? then he can have other options - free will I believe was mentioned earlier??
What would you suggest P-Angel? Youve contradicted yourself many times now..first you say dont chase, dont hang on, dont do this dont do that, now you're coming back saying Im playing games? Are you the dxp resident guidance counsellor? You're not doing a good job. You say leave him be, be patient, be understanding (which I have been about all of his problems and yes he has some issues to overcome), I do that then you say Im playing hard to get??
I understand the guy has issues, that he's not ready for a commitment and so I made a decision to leave him be but include him if/when he comes back and you say Im playing hard to get? WTF? where the hell does that come up?
Now what would you rather? I smother him??? Are you serious??
Im happy with my choice of living MY life the way I wish to live it and that means going out and having fun with my friends, yes dating others if need be and concentrating on my work, my sport and my home renovations - i think any sane person would think that's a good outcome here. If this man wants to go out on dates and IM free? then so be it, that'd be great - Id love that. And THAT is what is happening, he hasnt walked away but Im giving him his time and space to do what he needs to..I dont call him up, I dont annoy him, I dont "stalk him as you say I do", I dont email him, I dont text him non-stop, in fact you'd have to say Im a pretty damned good friend in that regard....he needs me he knows where I am, if I need him I know where he is, if he wants to date? he knows how to go about it and trust me HE KNOWS HOW TO DO IT.
I dont think Im playing hard to get - not sure where you get such stuff. Ive just made it clear Im not going to dwell on something I may never get - thats what you wanted right?? thats what you were telling me right? now you change your mind?
I may have put things a little wrong with "not lifting a finger" but Im sure, again, that any sane person would understand what that means
I never played hard to get once. Im simply living my life now...If he wants to be a part of it? AWESOME (and it would seem he does), if he doesnt? then he can have other options - free will I believe was mentioned earlier??
What would you suggest P-Angel? Youve contradicted yourself many times now..first you say dont chase, dont hang on, dont do this dont do that, now you're coming back saying Im playing games? Are you the dxp resident guidance counsellor? You're not doing a good job. You say leave him be, be patient, be understanding (which I have been about all of his problems and yes he has some issues to overcome), I do that then you say Im playing hard to get??
I understand the guy has issues, that he's not ready for a commitment and so I made a decision to leave him be but include him if/when he comes back and you say Im playing hard to get? WTF? where the hell does that come up?
Now what would you rather? I smother him??? Are you serious??
Im happy with my choice of living MY life the way I wish to live it and that means going out and having fun with my friends, yes dating others if need be and concentrating on my work, my sport and my home renovations - i think any sane person would think that's a good outcome here. If this man wants to go out on dates and IM free? then so be it, that'd be great - Id love that. And THAT is what is happening, he hasnt walked away but Im giving him his time and space to do what he needs to..I dont call him up, I dont annoy him, I dont "stalk him as you say I do", I dont email him, I dont text him non-stop, in fact you'd have to say Im a pretty damned good friend in that regard....he needs me he knows where I am, if I need him I know where he is, if he wants to date? he knows how to go about it and trust me HE KNOWS HOW TO DO IT.
I dont think Im playing hard to get - not sure where you get such stuff. Ive just made it clear Im not going to dwell on something I may never get - thats what you wanted right?? thats what you were telling me right? now you change your mind?
I may have put things a little wrong with "not lifting a finger" but Im sure, again, that any sane person would understand what that means
and P-Angel I do believe it was also you who may have said go and date others while he's not in commitment mode - correct me if Im wrong.
Im quite within my rights to date others, doesnt mean Im sleeping with them...doesnt mean he's sleeping with anybody else either.
Thats certainly not "playing hard to get"...that is what everybody seems to think is normal practice these days so Im going with what has been suggested time and time again and finally after all this time I think you may all be right there....still think Im playing hard to get? by living my life? by being his friend and seeing how things go??
Blah...whatever....guess who Im seeing all this next weekend? uh huh, the guy Im supposedly playing hard to get and guess who wants me to come along as his "date" in public with HIS friends and family next weekend? uh huh, that same guy.
There have been no dramas, no tears, no accusations, no nothings, I merely came on here to see what advice I could get...I got a lot of negative stuff I can tell you that, some incredibly contradictive stuff and the only person (excuse me the rest of you, some have been helpful and very supportive) who has truly seen through all of it has been tiki and as once before, she has shone through with the most enlightening and most accurate information I could have absorbed.
I am true to myself, nobody neednt worry about that and I couldnt be more loyal to this man for I do see a future...yes there will be some hurdles, there always are in ANY relationship - there isnt one relationship that is without flaws, without problems......but it would seem there are some people on this site that go around from board to board giving unbelievably stupid "advice"...I dont buy it and I dont buy the intention behind these people.
Sermon over, life to be lived...thank you all for sharing in this ummmm silly moment Ive had - days are over, new ones ahead...it aint really that hard
Im quite within my rights to date others, doesnt mean Im sleeping with them...doesnt mean he's sleeping with anybody else either.
Thats certainly not "playing hard to get"...that is what everybody seems to think is normal practice these days so Im going with what has been suggested time and time again and finally after all this time I think you may all be right there....still think Im playing hard to get? by living my life? by being his friend and seeing how things go??
Blah...whatever....guess who Im seeing all this next weekend? uh huh, the guy Im supposedly playing hard to get and guess who wants me to come along as his "date" in public with HIS friends and family next weekend? uh huh, that same guy.
There have been no dramas, no tears, no accusations, no nothings, I merely came on here to see what advice I could get...I got a lot of negative stuff I can tell you that, some incredibly contradictive stuff and the only person (excuse me the rest of you, some have been helpful and very supportive) who has truly seen through all of it has been tiki and as once before, she has shone through with the most enlightening and most accurate information I could have absorbed.
I am true to myself, nobody neednt worry about that and I couldnt be more loyal to this man for I do see a future...yes there will be some hurdles, there always are in ANY relationship - there isnt one relationship that is without flaws, without problems......but it would seem there are some people on this site that go around from board to board giving unbelievably stupid "advice"...I dont buy it and I dont buy the intention behind these people.
Sermon over, life to be lived...thank you all for sharing in this ummmm silly moment Ive had - days are over, new ones ahead...it aint really that hard
Chatz, it's one thing to go about your life, to move on ... it's another to not move on with your life and wait for him to notice that you dont need him so he'll come calling.
And that is what you are doing. The last time you did this to him, this going about your life .. it wasn't for YOU, to LIVE YOUR LIFE .. the intention was for him to see/realize waht he's missing out on so he'll come running back. The last time you did this, you even mentioned somewhere on a thread (I might be able to find it) .. you made reference that you are soaking up all the glory of the well deserved attention you are getting from him, as it's about time that he realized what he had and all that you have done for him.
That isn't moving on to live your life ... that is playing a head-game to get him so your ego can rejoice in having attention given to you. If you cannot recognize that difference, then I can't make you.
Why would you say I'm a counsellor? Are you mad? Do I sound like I have the diplomatic skills to be a counsellor to you? If so, then madness might just be your problem.
Even in this thread .. you say you are going to just go about your life until he comes around ... and this weekend even, he wants to be with you now and you haven't even lifted a finger. By saying it that way, meaning ... not even lifting a finger ... makes the impression upon peoples mind that you are taken advantage, being pompous.
Like you are just going to absorb all the attention he gives you and not even put forth any effort in return ... and this comes after you flipped the fuck out and made him feel bad, likely guilty, over not disclosing all information to you about his personal life .... when the two of you aren't even in an official relationship.
You make him feel guilty, like shit, then take the attitude that you don't need him in your life .. then when he comes calling, you accept nothing less than pampering (not lifting a finger) ....
Apparantly, you see nothing wrong with this, for you don't even recognize it's happening ... but, I do, and I'm sure others in here do see this for what it is.
Yes, I did tell you those things and they aren't contridictions ... it's just that I see now the you aren't sincere in being with him as a partner, what you are is sincere in having him give you things .... so, my change of mind isn't being a hypocrit, it's re-gauging my measurement of your intentions with this man, based on your treatment of him.
And that is what you are doing. The last time you did this to him, this going about your life .. it wasn't for YOU, to LIVE YOUR LIFE .. the intention was for him to see/realize waht he's missing out on so he'll come running back. The last time you did this, you even mentioned somewhere on a thread (I might be able to find it) .. you made reference that you are soaking up all the glory of the well deserved attention you are getting from him, as it's about time that he realized what he had and all that you have done for him.
That isn't moving on to live your life ... that is playing a head-game to get him so your ego can rejoice in having attention given to you. If you cannot recognize that difference, then I can't make you.
Why would you say I'm a counsellor? Are you mad? Do I sound like I have the diplomatic skills to be a counsellor to you? If so, then madness might just be your problem.
Even in this thread .. you say you are going to just go about your life until he comes around ... and this weekend even, he wants to be with you now and you haven't even lifted a finger. By saying it that way, meaning ... not even lifting a finger ... makes the impression upon peoples mind that you are taken advantage, being pompous.
Like you are just going to absorb all the attention he gives you and not even put forth any effort in return ... and this comes after you flipped the fuck out and made him feel bad, likely guilty, over not disclosing all information to you about his personal life .... when the two of you aren't even in an official relationship.
You make him feel guilty, like shit, then take the attitude that you don't need him in your life .. then when he comes calling, you accept nothing less than pampering (not lifting a finger) ....
Apparantly, you see nothing wrong with this, for you don't even recognize it's happening ... but, I do, and I'm sure others in here do see this for what it is.
Yes, I did tell you those things and they aren't contridictions ... it's just that I see now the you aren't sincere in being with him as a partner, what you are is sincere in having him give you things .... so, my change of mind isn't being a hypocrit, it's re-gauging my measurement of your intentions with this man, based on your treatment of him.
Im not being insinsere, Im not treating him like shit....I am merely getting on with my life. I WANT him in my life, its not like that at all. But Ive waited (and people said "dont wait, live your life") and waited and waited...that was wrong....now that I am getting busier, thats wrong.
He's no cheater either and in fact, I dont think Virgos are wired that way (although yes, any person can be).
With not lifting a finger blah blah I mean, Im not going to hang onto every word he says, im not going to wait for his calls, etc....it was doing my head in and THAT is why I got all upset because I made him my priority and that is wrong, I need to be priority in my life and then, and only then can I give somebody the best of me.
Seriously, if he chooses to have me in my life, I would be so happy, if he doesnt? Ive come to realise that hey, life goes on, he's not the one for me, I have to deal with that.
Trust me, I do nice things for him also by cooking him dinner (well not the last week LOL), I buy lunch or dinner sometimes (Im not the kind of person that expects to be taken care of as I have a good paying job, I own my own house, etc, etc), and Ive also bought him little treats, like his favourite chocolates, etc.....I think in this "relationship" whatever it is, Ive been very fair.
He isn't doing "jobs" for this girl....please understand that its not only him who offers to take her home and pick her up in the mornings (and in all fairness it IS on his way home, he's not going out of his way much at all). She hasnt had a blackout since and today (fingers crossed) she gets her results and hopefully gets the go-ahead to go driving again so she doesnt have to be a burden anymore and trust me, that is what she'd really like too. He's not being manipulative, he is simply being a Virgo, helping those who cant help themselves (also said in this thread previously).
Im happy to go about my life, to see where it takes me/us. If he wants to hook up and Im not busy, as I said, GREAT, if not? I have to be busy enough to not dwell on it. Thats not taking advantage of him because I DO want him in my life but if the man isnt ready or willing? what am I to do? sit at home and mope? Ive done that, look where it got me, now I want to get out and about and show him that I have a life other than him (which he'd appreciate), Im playing head games.
Hmmmmm see how these suggestions are confusing?
He's no cheater either and in fact, I dont think Virgos are wired that way (although yes, any person can be).
With not lifting a finger blah blah I mean, Im not going to hang onto every word he says, im not going to wait for his calls, etc....it was doing my head in and THAT is why I got all upset because I made him my priority and that is wrong, I need to be priority in my life and then, and only then can I give somebody the best of me.
Seriously, if he chooses to have me in my life, I would be so happy, if he doesnt? Ive come to realise that hey, life goes on, he's not the one for me, I have to deal with that.
Trust me, I do nice things for him also by cooking him dinner (well not the last week LOL), I buy lunch or dinner sometimes (Im not the kind of person that expects to be taken care of as I have a good paying job, I own my own house, etc, etc), and Ive also bought him little treats, like his favourite chocolates, etc.....I think in this "relationship" whatever it is, Ive been very fair.
He isn't doing "jobs" for this girl....please understand that its not only him who offers to take her home and pick her up in the mornings (and in all fairness it IS on his way home, he's not going out of his way much at all). She hasnt had a blackout since and today (fingers crossed) she gets her results and hopefully gets the go-ahead to go driving again so she doesnt have to be a burden anymore and trust me, that is what she'd really like too. He's not being manipulative, he is simply being a Virgo, helping those who cant help themselves (also said in this thread previously).
Im happy to go about my life, to see where it takes me/us. If he wants to hook up and Im not busy, as I said, GREAT, if not? I have to be busy enough to not dwell on it. Thats not taking advantage of him because I DO want him in my life but if the man isnt ready or willing? what am I to do? sit at home and mope? Ive done that, look where it got me, now I want to get out and about and show him that I have a life other than him (which he'd appreciate), Im playing head games.
Hmmmmm see how these suggestions are confusing?
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